Discussion in 'Pop & Justice' started by Robert, Jun 25, 2018.
Oh, it’s definitely picking up “cultural appropriation” reactions too and is being reported in the gutter press here as such.
I screamed so much at this hot take. A mess.
But yeah, there is nuance and context to understand, in the end, like @londonrain stated.
Posting one black person's approval really isn' it, either, though.
Oh I'm sure some people have aired concerns and I'm not trying to involve myself in anyway over that conversation and how it goes for either side between black Americans and non-American black people, particularly black Caribbeans. I think it's a nuanced conversation between them, though I imagine UK tabloids don't have good intentions reusing a lot of the same tweets across multiple articles.
My point was just a kind of apprehension to one or two posts showing a turning into a kind of reactionary scolding on "the cancel culture warriors" which seems to ignore that a significant portion of tweets and posts from what people would consider black American twitter are meant for fun and comedy, even if including a touch of criticism or commentary. It is totally 100% nuanced, so to see the direction slightly veer into a pile on of a certain group felt so odd and out of nowhere. Like I don't think the one or two posts trying to make this about cancel culture gone amok again grasp the kind of nuance you are bringing to the conversation so to go from your nuanced take to seeing a post like that by another user was so jarring ddd.
Part of my issue with people trying to throw the “cultural appropriation” label at this is how easily that feeds into the narrative of “woke people want to cancel everything!” - because it’s hard to establish in this instance how Adele is benefiting at the expense of the people whose culture she is adopting (which is usually the hallmark of actual cultural appropriation).
This. In some ways it’s becoming easier than ever for the likes of the D*ily M*il or the The S*n to discredit actual issues and events, because they will find some kind of Tweet that supports their view that ‘the liberals are on the attack again’. As always, as much as good as social media does it does just as much harm.
Hot take: I actually do want white people like Adele to engage with and understand my culture. I don't want them to run off and act like it's theirs to use and discard as they please (hi Madonna's Ray of Light-era dabblings) but respectfully engaging with a celebration of my cultural identity? Sure, knock yourself out.
Case in point: yoga was actively popularised by Indians abroad (notably Swami Vivekananda, who visited the US in the late 19th century) and to this day there are plenty of Indian yogis who are more than willing to teach white people yoga - but that's not the same as Karen from Milwaukee teaching a yoga class and adding some Sanskrit prayer at the end that she doesn't understand or believe in just to make yoga sound "mystical".
I'm actually crying reading everyone's comments here. Thank you.
Wait @ this actually being really good. Ddd.
Counterpoint: Black Americans ARE right to ring the bells. There SHOULD absolutely be a discussion every time this happens because non-Black people have ALWAYS taken advantage of and bastardize Black cultures for benefit. You guys won't help yourself, so we're here to remind you to keep it cute. Hell, most of y'all just acknowledged anti-Blackness in MAY!
Also, bantu knots is an African style, not Jamaican. There were PLENTY of Jamaican Brits with legitimate concerns, but y'all ignore them tho. Y'all say white Brits are appreciating culture while the British gov't is literally deporting the Windrush generation. How about no more appreciating Black culture until all of y'all protect us from anti-Blackness ok?
Sure, the discussion should happen, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're right in this specific instance. My mother was born under in a country under colonialism and my father was born one year after his country achieved independence - in both cases in countries colonised by the British, who had no compunctions wreaking economic destruction and literally committing mass murder in the interest of profit and the "white man's burden". The British made their country into a global superpower in large part by taking advantage of and bastardising my parents' cultures for their own benefit - which they continue to do to this day.
Does that mean that there is literally no situation in which a white person can wear the clothes of either of those countries? I don't think so. I do object to people wearing them as a sort of fancy dress, but I don't object to them being worn in a space that is run by and populated with people native to those countries.
(Also, I'm not sure it sits right with me having Americans - black or otherwise - tell black British people what they should and should not be offended by. Why is it up to Black AMERICANS to ring alarm bells?)
This is a fair point... and is also why I asked whether Jamaican Brits were raising concerns. I'm absolutely willing to listen and learn. Is there a history of Bantu knots being linked to the carnival and/or Caribbean culture, or has Adele completely misunderstood their cultural relevance to Afro-Caribbean culture and just made some dodgy mashup of multiple Black cultures that an actual Afro-Caribbean person wouldn't have done?
I mean, we been knew that this government is racist AF. Is your point here that it would be okay for Adele to do this if she had demonstrated stronger allyship to Caribbean people by speaking out openly about Windrush and the British government's treatment of black people generally?
Umm... yes, that’s the bare minimum. The govt is made of people voted in and if the people can’t get together to protect the windrush generation than none of the ppl should get to enjoy the culture.
Also the sight of seeing Black ppl chastise other Blacks to protect a white woman wearing Bantu knots in 2020 (w/ non Blacks here chiming in?) Goofiness on another level.
But this goes back to the original point: is this a case of Black Americans telling Black British people whether this is acceptable or not, without understanding what the Notting Hill Carnival is or why it exists? Because the Black Britons I’ve seen in this thread so far have been landing on the side of this not constituting cultural appropriation, and I’m not going to tell them that their feelings are correct or incorrect.
Most Black folks on my timeline yesterday (including myself) popped off jokes about this, and now I woke up to another senseless diaspora war on my timeline over Adele.
Make it make sense.
What is there to understand about the history of the event? You know it was created because ppl that look like Adele kept going around bashing Jamaicans upside their head? The history of the event is similar to the West Indian parade in Brooklyn and Caribana in Toronto. It’s all the same. So how does any of that translate to Adele being able to wear Bantu knots?
Again, I can’t go around appreciating gay culture if I’m doing fuck all to protect gay people. Words mean things.
And yes, @superultra, Black ppl, including me, were getting these jokes in yesterday. My point is that the argument from Black Americans is valid and to disregard the convo as another “senseless diaspora war” is flippant.
Babes, we're on the same side here. I'm concurring with other Black Americans here. I'm mostly talking about how Afro-Caribbeans and Africans on Twitter started dragging Black Americans before they could even brush their teeth this morning.
Interesting take here from Labour MP David Lammy
It's all gucci. Just a little misunderstanding. ❤️️
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