Discussion in 'TV + Film' started by Someboy, Oct 4, 2011.
Why not 50 different aliens from 50 different planets?
Cuz Ryan doesn’t have the range!
I really want next season to be a period piece; Civil War, 1960s alien abductions, or something in the vein of the Mr. March story - a serial killer before forensics, where you could basically get away with anything.
I was listening to a true crime podcast that told a story that I thought would be brilliant (I was literally plotting it out in my head ddd) about a young man in the late 1960s who was a paranoid schizophrenic, believed he spoke to the devil, was released from an asylum when he shouldn't have been and ended up murdering an entire family of nine people on their farm (including a baby) except for one 4-year-old daughter who he thought was an angel. I just think the show works so much better when it's grounded in reality and has some genuine terror. The camp and ridiculousness always has to be there, but it's better when it's an add-on to the horror and drama. They really need to work on creating relatable, exciting characters again. First and foremost, being invested in / worried about the characters is what makes the show scary; Cult and Apocalypse both lacked that.
In reality, I'm sure Murphy will go for another 'topical' season set in 2025. AHS: Me Too, or AHS: Climate Change. Sarah Paulson plays a scientist, a valley girl, a crackhead trapeze artist, and an alien. Evan Peters plays a bisexual male model who gets naked and fucks every other member of the cast. Leslie Grossman plays an Instagram-famous 'fun mom'. Emma Roberts plays a bitch. Cheyanne Jacksons plays a Hollywood executive whose name we'll never remember and gets dicked down twice then disappears. Kathy Bates plays a character who's only relevant to prop up another character.
Are you sure they won't go after you for spoiling all the key elements like that?
I left out the major casting as to not spoil things; Billy Eichner plays struggling drag queen Gagzilla Slayzalot, and Joan Collins plays his grandmother Matilda Marble, a necrophiliac jazz singer who used to date Humphrey Bograt (played by Evan Peters) and Grace Kelly (also played by Evan Peters).
I'm still mad they wasted the Cult theme. I wanted a season loosely resembling the movie The Village, and instead we got that semi-baked mess.
Switch out Grace Kelly for Lauren Bacall and we're all set for a momentum-killing mid-season episode where Evan Peters reenacts most of The Big Sleep.
See, I've never found the characters to be the main draw of American Horror Story; it's always been more about the concepts for me, the overarching themes and how they crumble across the season to reveal the true reality. In Coven, it was about the karmic consequences people face even when they have ways to circumvent death. Roanoke was real world corruption meeting insidious evil. Cult was essentially the Stanford prison experiment set to a tumultuous political climate. Apocalypse toyed with fate and what the "true" reality was.
I'm not saying they were all executed perfectly, but I think the deaths of every main character in Murder House (the inevitability of death and atonement for "sins") set us up for a series where the characters are disposable and more functional than relatable. I personally find that captivating for a television series, and seeing people reduced to their most corrupt and chaotic selves in Cult is why I'll always go to bat for it.
Great characters were so essential to the early seasons; Constance, Vivian, Moira, Tate, etc. The terror in Murder House came through being placed in Vivian's shoes - not understanding what was going on around her and being convinced by others that she was going insane. Constance was so wonderfully twisted and complicated.
In Asylum the characters were literally the heart of the story amidst the madness. All of the horror was rooted in the audience's compassion for Lana and Kit. And Lange was once again given an incredibly complex character who you both feared and rooted for. They got away with so many ridiculous plotlines (human experiments, demon possession, aliens, serial killer santa) because the characters felt real and grounded. That started wavering around Coven. The highlight of Hotel for me remains the Liz Taylor arc because they again managed to actually get me attached to a character. When there's no one to root for or no stakes involved (ie. when all of the characters are one-dimensional and/or no one can really die, like in Apocalypse), there's no real horror.
I kind of wish they made Lily Rabe shine more, honestly, I mean
She was superb as Mary Eunice and showed a great versatility, I don't get the obsession of Murphy with Paulson and Peters, both great, but the spotlight they are given is a bit too much (and poor Kathy Bates, such an iconic actress relegated too often to such irrilevant roles).
And I think that's where we differ: the horror is an aspect of my enjoyment of the show but is easily supplemented by the camp or Frances Conroy quips or Adina Porter being a slow burning series highpoint in the background. I agree with everything you're saying but I'm also...really satisfied with every season besides Apocalypse because it gave me one or move of the above?
But I also had characters that I really loved in Cult: Beverly and Winter were two of my favorite additions to the series and I was impressed with Evan Peters in a way I hadn't been yet. So I think it's just a matter of differing tastes.
Yea, for me the camp & quips are useless if there's nothing of substance to back them up. I love Francis Conroy but I feel like she deserves so much better (same with poor Kathy Bates). It's been a real adjustment getting used to what AHS is now versus what it started off as. It used to be a genuinely great, ridiculous ride, where the camp & humor evened out the drama and horror. Now it's sort of b-movie cheesy with more camp and satire than any substance. It's just not what I signed up for, I guess.
I agree that Evan was fantastic in Cult. Pity that the writing was absolutely atrocious. I really didn't like Winter at all. Billie Lourd is so one-note and wooden. I always want to like her but end up left cold by her performance.
I agree about Kathy Bates as well; a complete waste of her talents being such...one note villains. Though that dodgy accent in Roanoke wasn't doing her any favors.
I didn't start watching AHS for the campiness and quips, which is why I think the first two seasons are the best. I don't watch horror movies for that unless it's specifically marketed as such (Killer Klowns, Funhouse), which is why I think I've been so let down by Cult and Apocalypse. The actual storylines have taken a backseat to fan service dialogue and being overly self referential for a series that was never supposed to intersect. If it was marketed as some B-movie type horror show like Scream Queens was, then I'd probably be a bit more lenient in my criticism of later seasons. Coven is really when it started going downhill because Ryan saw the response to some of the witches and just rewrote scripts seemingly the week before shoots just to appeal to fans with complete disregard for finishing the story the first half of the season set up.
This pretty much sums up my feelings. There were parts of Apocalypse I liked, some of the crossover was done well, but some of it was pure fan fiction.
I actually enjoyed the first two episodes a lot, but to then later find out they were in vein was disappointing. Also the entirety of episode 8 was garbage with the tech guys. They spent so much time storytelling things we already knew, and rushing through parts which were more important. Also, regarding the ending:
I didn't even recognise that the couple who spawned the new Satan were from outpost 3. Shows you how irrelevant their characters were ddd
This was an enjoyable watch:
As I was watching this on Fox in the UK and we were two weeks behind the US, I've just read the last 40 pages in one go. Most amusing was around episode 5 people saying "I hope there's not much more flashback".
I thought Cody Fern was really good - he showed real difference between younger Michael and Less-tat. Jessica Lange saved any episode she was in (so just the two). Dumb and Dumber was okay as a quick joke but two episodes centred around their importance to the end of the world...no. The angle of tech guys being involved could have worked but why make them joke characters with bowl cuts?
As I'm reading the thread I'm thinking "Oh I forgot about that scene. And that one. Oh and that one." Such a lot happened a lot of which was pointless. And it was only by reading this thread that I realised who the characters in the final scene even were.
It was a mess of ideas which could have been sent in a different order. Two storylines separated by 7 episodes so that episode 10 you've forgotten what even happened in 1-3. Too much "this will make a great gif" direction and scripting.
Why, why WHY is Frances Conroy's name not on the opening credits? They amount she was in this, the work she did and she's just a guest star? Cheyenne Jackson was on every opening credit scene and he was barely in the sodding thing.
A mess, but a watchable mess.
Who were the characters in the final scene? I must have lost the "plot"...
The young couple from the bunker in the first 3 episodes, who broke the rules and played “hide the wand in the plot hole”.
Just give me the Coven spin-off I crave.
Honestly just call it Coven and give us week after week of witchy drama.
Separate names with a comma.