General Madonna Discussion | Page 2743 | The Popjustice Forum

General Madonna Discussion

Discussion in 'Pop & Justice' started by debord, Jan 14, 2009.

  1. This is so Music Sounds Better With You/ Holiday; the whole time you keep waiting for those two additional chords to appear - it feels like such a tease. I still wish she'd perform the album version on the tour, though.
    Womanizer and torontodj like this.
  2. Do you have a link ? I can't find it anywhere on spotify/apple music.
  3. Her image problems are due to her refusal to conform to what people want an older woman to be. So she's won no matter what people think of her.

    Also, plenty of people still respect her and a lot of the people who don't are ageist, sexist, or close-minded. She has always been a divisive artist/cultural figure and she always will be. Fan handwringing over her image and what be think of her is missing the point of Madonna.

    Finally, people need to get over her declining commercial success. She is sixty one in the fourth decade of her career. It's natural that she's more of a nice artist now. And Madame X was never going to be a hit with the GP. It is wildly experimental, with only a few songs on it that are easy listens.
    relby likes this.
  4. I’m emo
  5. It just seems to be on that remix website (which I’m not sure if you can name)
  6. I wish I met or I've seen one positive comment about her that is not on pop forums. Sure pop music lovers respect her legacy even if they don't listen to her, but that's not the common thing among public these days...

    And she's not doing anything to remind people why she is where she is. Look at Mariah how she turned things around last few years, from someone who was hated and mocked even more than Madonna to this era where she became very likable, respected, polished, acclaimed, and people are reminded that she is artist first, and celebrity second. Madonna is too stubborn to accept the fact thaht she is legacy act and that she needs to treat her legacy better, and it backfired, and it will backfire even more.
  7. The public NEVER liked her. Maybe for 3 seconds during the Evita/Ray Of Light years but that’s it. This is what the woman herself said to Spin magazine in 1998:

    I’m too left-of-center. I’ll never have mainstream acceptance, never. I’ve had moments of it, fleeting moments, but I don’t think my sensibilities are palatable to the mainstream. I mean, I’m an unwed mother. I’ve kissed girls in public.
  8. Whatever.
    If you want to pretend that she is currently in the same situation she was her whole career, go ahead, I won't.
  9. Fans were clamoring for Madonna to be experimental again and she put out one of her most experimental records ever. Fans were clamoring for Madonna to serve visuals with a grand artistic vision again and Madonna put out three out four videos that did just that. In addition, Madonna has re-invented her stage show. The Madame X era was 100% focused on artistry. And the album was acclaimed. Not as much as Caution, but Madame X took more risks and Madonna carries more cultural baggage, so that's no surprise.

    How is Madonna not treating her legacy well? What about the Madame X era shows that "she is too stubborn to accept that she's a legacy act?" What about the Madame X damaged her legacy? Is it that she's not making an album with a throwback sound? Of course Madonna is going to keep trying to push forward. That's what makes Madonna Madonna.
  10. She's not selling as much as she used to, but that's natural. Yes, some people think she's a joke. Many of those people are sexist and ageist. But she just put out an album that both fans and critics hailed as a return to Madonna, the artistic visionary. Why are you ignoring that?
    JMRGBY and electrosamurai like this.
  11. You didn't get what I said. I'm pretty sure fans remember her art well!
  12. Well Eurovision comes to mind.
  13. What's your point here? That she doesn't appeal as much to the GP anymore? We been knew. Mariah doesn't either, going by the sales of Caution.
    JMRGBY and electrosamurai like this.
  14. Yeah, it was a fuck up. People make mistakes. Do you have anything else?
  15. I’ve been a fan of Madonna since 1983. I can’t remember a time when I didn’t have to vigorously defend her (except perhaps the Evita/Ray of Light era). The worst has been 92/93 and present day.

    There is a particular vitriol reserved for Madonna. Ageism and misogyny simply exacerbated the hatred for her.
  16. Sales are only reflection of their fan base, nothing else. Mariah's reputation is in much better place these days, and just few years ago she was in much worse situation. But she worked to clean her image.
  17. The main thing is that she really doesn't need any validation for "General Public" or New Generations or anything at all. Woman is on her 14th album, on her 11th Tour, 40 years making music... And she's history. You can't erase "Madonna".

    I don't think Madonna is seem as a Joke, but it's just that they will think "Oh she's old lol" and... right. She is. Every popstar (hopefully) will age and they should pray that their faves will be releasing AMAZING music+visuals+tour when they're around their 60s... and doing it mainly for their fans + their own pleasure without the pressure of needing to achieve something bigger.

    I started listening to Madonna when I was 12 (I'm 19) because I was just interested. I knew that she had been around for so long and she was doing the MDNA Tour and it was like "You know... she's a legend. I want to know more" and I just dived into every album, getting one-by-one and it was... Like I don't have words to describe it at all, but I took my time to enjoy each one of them and didn't just play everything at once. (before this, the only record I listened in full was Confessions because my brother had it on CD and he used to play it a lot) I really got "Ray Of Light" and then listened to it til I wanted something else and then I got "Erotica" and I was like "Wow it's the same woman!". And I did it with every album. I believe the last ones I listened to were True Blue and the Debut and it was just a portal to meet the majesty of 80s music in general and new artists. Or how Bedtime Stories got me into R&B. Or American Life made me appreciate the use of Guitars and that you can mix Electronic beats with Acoustic Instruments. These were real lessons.

    And... I'm the lucky one. I'm glad I decided to look back and listen to Madonna and feel BLESSED because I have no fucking clue of where I would be (musically) If I didn't. And, for real, Madonna didn't need me to listen to her music (lol). She was doing an almost (2 dates) sold out Stadium show in a few weeks, and that was enough to make me curious about her.

    Really... it's so much bigger than this. Words are useless.
    DJBenW, Dr Pop, madgemad and 7 others like this.
  18. I'm unbelieveably happy about the Like a Prayer re-release!
    Andrew.L, WhatKindOfKylie? and Cundy like this.
  19. That is objectively false. Madame X scored 5/6 points better than Hard Candy and MDNA on Metacritic and reached 70, which is a perfectly respectable score. It didn't do that much better on Meta than Rebel Heart, but that makes sense since Rebel Heart was considered a course correction. But the scores don't tell the whole story: the vast majority of the reviews said that the record was artistically daring and that Madonna seemed more artistically engaged than she has in a long time. They just varied on how well it worked. Not to mention that some of the negative reviews were ageist.

    Again, what did the Madame X era do to tarnish her legacy? And what do you suggest she should have done instead?
    Up Down Suite and electrosamurai like this.
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