General Michael Jackson Discussion. | Page 64 | The Popjustice Forum

General Michael Jackson Discussion.

Discussion in 'Pop & Justice' started by 777jonny777, Oct 24, 2008.

  1. Exactly. I used to love watching Community but now I know that Yvette is like this, I won't watch it anymore. It's not affecting her as such but I won't support anything she does.
    Espeon likes this.
  2. Not sure what's worse. Being like Yvette and standing for a pedophile.

    Or being like Joey - and trying to play the "theres fine people on both sides" card.

    Drinking game: do a shot every time he says IF THIS IS TRUE. You'll be blacked out by the end of this video.

  3. He may not have been found guilty by a court but growing up I always had the impression that it was obvious that he was a pedophile. People harping "the FBI had 10yrs and they couldn't make it stick so leave his legacy alone." kill me. Where there is smoke there is always fire. And in this case there was no shortage of smoke. Just because the prosecutors couldn't find the fire through all the smoke doesn't mean you stay in the house and die of smoke inhalation. This is the part that I cannot get over.... all of these celebs, social media stans and even causal fans coming out of the woodwork in MJs defense. LIKE HOW DENSE CAN YOU BE?!?!

    Having 3 close friends in my life who were molested as children, the documentary and Oprah after special obviously put me thru it! That being what it is... the victim blaming that's happening is adding a whole new level of disgust to the whole thing. The suicide rate for victims of molestation is no joke. These are SURVIVORS and they deserve respect.
    Txetxu, POPGASM, Alenko and 7 others like this.
  4. Whew don't read Facebook comments on articles about this if you're planning to have a good day.
    QueenB, Noir, GimmeWork and 3 others like this.
  5. Okay!
    ohnostalgia, evilsin, LTG and 11 others like this.

  6. Why is Joey Fatone on TV in 2019. Stop giving idiots a platform.
    Mr Blonde, Alenko, mcuk and 9 others like this.
  7. It's chilling how many people have defended him to me in person. It got brought up at work several times and the rage some of these Gen X'ers displayed... whew the ghetto
  8. The defense I hear is that he was frail, simple, easy to take advantage of.... I think he's seen by a lot of people like a wounded bird that they want to protect, like someone who's being bullied in High School. The same people say "well R. Kelly now he's clearly guilty". R. Kelly started the crying/ poor me act too late.
  9. *NSYNC cancelled.
    ohaimanabu likes this.
  10. I feel like the revisionism in here re: his talent and legacy is a bit...much. He was a musical genius and arguably the best performer/entertainer of all time. I just don't think he would have amassed such success and such a following without those qualities being either true or accurate. Like, I agree he wasn't as daring or interesting as Madonna or Janet, and I didn't connect with him/his music in the same way I have with them/theirs, but he was a virtuoso.

    I idolized him as a kid in the 90s. The Will You Be There video was tacked on at the end of the Free Willy VHS (nn don't), and I swear I must have watched it at least 100 times. Then there was HIStory, one of the few things that brought my brother and I together in our childhood. When I was like 8 or 9, I burned a "double CD" with Michael on the first half and Madonna on the second. A couple friends and I even choreographed some stupid thing to Smooth Criminal in 6th grade and performed it in front of the class. He was just it: joyous, socially conscious, truly larger than life. I mean, God-like. I still feel that way about his talent.

    Of course he was always odd But as I grew older, reflected more on my own childhood, and learned more about his, I empathized to be honest. Truth be told, I was consistently abused by one parent (physically and emotionally) and neglected by the other. (I'm talking bad I tried to move out but my other parent declined to take me in). I think in a way it was easy to latch on to the narrative he spun because I could understand where his paranoia and isolation came from. It doesn't explain or excuse any of the abuse he leveled on these kids, obviously, but he was a victim of child abuse. I figured the body modification was a response to being abused, as well as his kind of "rebellious" (for lack of a better word) descent into Neverland. In my eyes, he was taking control of his life and living it the way he wanted to. I mean, I guess he did do that, but not at all in the way I imagined, sadly. Truthfully, I just thought he was asexual and was a caretaker and wanted to spread joy. I don't know, I saw him as a very noble person who was clearly fucked up but desperately trying to do something positive with his situation and his life. And I really thought he was largely misunderstood.

    I've mentioned this elsewhere on here, but I do feel groomed, or at least duped. Watching the documentary made me realize how easy it could have been to fall into his trap. It's been disturbing to think about, particularly as someone who has experienced abuse across the gamut. I think what really kills me is how nefarious he was. He wasn't a caretaker like I imagined. He wasn't concerned with others' (i.e., children's) wellbeing. He was concerned with himself and his own desires. And he knew what he was doing was wrong. I think that's been the last straw for me, getting over the idea that maybe he was so warped he didn't realize what he was doing was inappropriate. But he knew and he actively tried to hide it.

    This is...a lot and maybe too personal. So I apologize in advance. But, surprisingly, I've had a ton of feelings about this whole thing. He's effectively packaged away for me. I don't want to support him/his estate, and his music will never be the same. But I do feel like it's all a real shame, first and foremost for the victims, but also for those of us who saw something otherworldly in him that wasn't totally accurate. A false idol.
    Hyrulian, Robert, Mr Blonde and 46 others like this.
  11. I'll just copy and paste what I posted in the other thread.

    I watched the documentary (1 and 2) and yeah....its some pretty heavy stuff. I did hours of research. Dont get me wrong I'm still skeptical about Wade but I definitely believe in Jimmy. I had to look up so much just so I'm not being "brainwashed" by the media and honestly as much as I hate to say it, this time around, his stans are the ones that are doing the brainwashing.

    I noticed one of his stans photoshopped one of the court documents for their favor and it went viral on twitter until someone from LipstickAlley posted one of the real court documents and I was surprised how many people were shocked.

    Also the photos of his "Art Books" are triggering and disturbing as hell. His fans are trying to excuse it as "It was legally published" but does that make it ok? Definitely not especially with the allegations. They also refuse to bring up the fact that a lot of the "10,000" books he owed had multiple naked photos of children.

    His fans also need to stop bringing up race. As an Afro Latino/African American, MJ does not get a pass. I dont speak for all black folks of course and I do understand where his fans are coming from because I think there NEEDS to be a documentary for Harvey Weinstein, Kevin Spacey etc and I'm surprised Dan Schneider's pedophile ass hasn't been cancelled and exposed publicly yet however that doesn't mean we need to ignore the problematic history of MJ. MJ also had deep self hatred.

    A few of my family members and friends refuse to believe the allegations but my grandfather who is a fan of MJ and Motown in general he admits that there is no excuse especially with the "art books", sleeping with children in bed, the voicemails, the jewelry store video, etc

    This is pretty heavy for me because I grew up listening to MJ and I truly believed the world was too harsh on him especially as a black man but I also understand the immense power he had and how we cherry pick who is right and who is wrong. My cousin also loves his music and when saw the documentary and those "photos" she got triggered and felt uneasy since one of our uncles (who is dead now) used to grab her thighs, ass and breast hard from when she was 8 to 11. She kept it a secret for years because she was afraid of our uncle beating her and her mother up. He would buy her many gifts for xmas and take her to the bathroom to braid her hair and touch her inappropriately. It still effects her til this day. She is traumatized by the experience and dates nobody (she is 29 now). She admitted what happened two years after he died and many family members would tell her to "pray it away" and we believed her because we've witnessed his sketchy behavior but never expected he would have gone that far. Its exactly why I cant really defend MJ without being biased. There's just many indefensible information against him. Its unsettling. I'm sorry if I also sound ignorant by saying this but I dont know if I will stop listening to his music. MJ's music has helped many people's lives and his music is a representation of my childhood but I also cant be biased. I definitely wont be streaming his music though just cd audio files from over the years

    I will admit, I do hate how they mainly make documentaries on black rapists/pedophiles/abusers etc. I'm going to need to see a Harvey Weinstein documentary soon as well as Kevin and Dan Schneider.

    Overall I do think MJ is guilty and I hate saying that but I have to be fair.
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
  12. Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
    AshleyKerwin, lushLuck and Noir like this.
  13. His talent as a performer/entertainer was incredible, certainly one of the best, and you could make a strong argument for being the best. However, for me, his music has always been overhyped to high heaven. That hasn't changed.
  14. I don’t get the sense there’s a lot of revinsioniam here; just people like myself who were never that impressed with the Michael hype finally having a safe space to express it.
    Ferk, Mr.Arroz, LTG and 13 others like this.

  15. So glad this is her position. I love her.
    Robert, Meathook, Mikl C and 19 others like this.
  16. So... TMZ confirmed that the boy was James Safechuck

  17. I’ve had to think twice about getting into public discussions because even people that you wouldn’t expect to be fans proclaim his innocence. The delusion and media manipulation jumped out.
    EricG1990, snoho and biffy77 like this.
  18. I work in TV distribution. The company I work for has a documentary on Harvey Weinstein featuring interviews with his alleged victims and former MIramax colleagues, plus hidden camera footage showing his inappropriate behaviour. It's fronted by a reputable (female) journalist and produced by an award winning news production team. We haven't been able to sell it into the US yet because all the networks say they have Weinstein documentaries already. (I'm assuming you're in the US!).
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019
  19. I'm just so annoyed that people defend him without even watching it. Watch it and then tell me you don't believe it.
  20. Most aren't even fans. I have time for fans. I feel for them. They're wrong and absurd but I understand their position. Most people I've seen sharing his song or pro-articles are just 'Jesy posting R Kelly story' trolls.

    They all need to
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    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019
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