LGBTQIA+ | Page 1088 | The Popjustice Forum


Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Babylon, Aug 15, 2012.

  1. Honestly, if I'm having a bad day or tough time, dealing with someone who is always sarcastic and cunty can really tip me over the edge and it has an effect on how I see that person. A close friend has been rubbing me up the wrong way with this constant sarcasm in the past while. It's like, sometimes being warm and friendly is enough... you dont need to prove you're above everything and everyone. Also when you're struggling to stay positive or cope, an onslaught of negative sarcasm is really too much too handle. On a good day I do love a good evil banter.. but yes, it's a read the room situation.
    Robert, Remyky22, Jamie and 23 others like this.
  2. Oh my god, can the straggots just mind their damn business for once instead of policing how we talk about OURSELVES in the name of ~allyship~?
  3. londonrain

    londonrain Staff Member

    Serving “white person complaining about black people using the N-word” vibes.
  4. I work with a trans woman who I think just turned 60. And she uses the t-word a lot because, obviously a few decades ago, that word wasn't as taboo as it is now. And she said it in the break room and had to have a talking to, but by a trans manager of mine actually. But only really because there was a straight cis brand rep visiting our store and she was also in the break room.
    Kind of stupid, I don't think we should have to censor ourselves like that just to protect innocent straight cis people's ears? What words we use for ourselves is none of their business.

    I remember years ago someone straight+cis asked how I identify and I said queer and they were so confused as to how that wasn't calling myself a slur. But honestly, I see that word used more in my life as a positive identifier than a slur. That's the power of taking back words. And if we damn them every time we try to do that, it'll never be claimed by ourselves.
  5. This actually makes me furious. I would have given the manager a talking-to right back!
    Island, boombazookajoe and londonrain like this.
  6. She's a sweet lady. She's actually a former Miss Continental. So she just went along with it. Basically the manager told her she can say those words when it's just us but when there's people from outside our store visiting, she has to make it more P.C. - I think that's all a bit eyerolly, too. She wasn't saying it as a slur. And she's literally a trans woman. If a trans woman saying the t word is going to make a straight cis person uncomfortable... Gurl, get over it. At least the manager who heard it being said and pulled her aside is trans herself. But my manager is like in her 20s. The word feels different for her than for my coworker because of the generations in between them.
  7. londonrain

    londonrain Staff Member

    I remember one of the first things my dad said to me after I came out was “don’t use the word queer to describe yourself.” Why do you care?!
    Island, Music Is Death, LTG and 10 others like this.
  8. Allow me to drop a hot take as usual:

    If a trans woman saying the T-word makes a cishet person uncomfortable, FUCKING GOOD. Let them get a small, momentary taste of what we've been subjected to for decades.

    Also I ran out of data before I could edit my earlier post, but yes, "What words we use for ourselves is none of their business" is spot-on.
  9. I think with older trans people especially there’s this awkward policing of their self defined language as ‘outdated’ that ends up forcing them to use terminology they personally don’t prescribe to. It reminds me of the the circular discourse a lot of very young queer people fall into around ‘identifying’ figures such as Marsha P Johnson using modern words when they simply were not in use at the time.

    Like engaging with queer history and ‘the older generation’ often exists as this tightrope of navigating outdated language while respecting what that language represented at another time. Which can be divisive and create a dialogue shift away from what essentially remains the most important issues and common ground.

    I mean ultimately I think the goals remain the same and often the battle is to fight against distortion of those goals; often by culture wars stirred up to create proxy issues such as language, bathroom usage, or the endless questions of ‘validity’ vs more tangible and urgent fights around issues of healthcare and wealth inequality. Not that the former issues are unimportant but they are almost designed by the right to create debates that distract from enacting policies that will change and help the most pressing needs of the trans and none binary community.
  10. I feel the solution is fairly easy though, everyone should mind their own business instead of policing other people’s language. I’m specifically talking about young Gay to older Gay interpersonal relations.

    If someone wants to call themselves/identify as something, don’t tell them they are not allowed to even if that something offends you.

    The only time one should say something is if it’s directed to yourself. Example; I don’t like being called “Queer”, I won’t stop anyone from calling themselves “Queer” and will respectfully address you as such but I will (with decreasing politeness) tell you to refrain from calling me “Queer”.
    TrendyMüller and londonrain like this.
  11. tea


    This ejected me from my own body
  12. It’s not my invention (someone used it on here the other day, and I’ve seen it on either Twitter or Reddit before) but I LOVE it so much.
    spaceship and tea like this.
  13. I can’t WAIT until the day someone tells me I can’t call myself a faggot.
    Island, LPT, Overdose and 2 others like this.
  14. I mean, I think the thing with my coworkers is just that someone else was in the room. My older trans coworker has said the t word around the younger trans manager a lot of times, and to me, and to other coworkers. It was only an issue when a visiting brand rep was at our store. She's not a total stranger, she comes to our store every month or two. But like... How is she going to get offended? I don't see the why my manager told my coworker to watch who she says that word around. It's just stupid.
    I work at a retail store, not an office. I know there's still like policies around discriminatory things. But a trans woman referring to herself as the t word or talking about her "t word friends" is not discriminatory.

    Reminds me of the time on grindr I told someone I did drag and he told me that drag is an insult to women and especially trans women because it is mocking and he "has a lot of trans friends who have told them they are offended by drag", completely negating the fact that trans women are a huge presence in the drag world.
    Can we all just let people be who they wanna be, do what they wanna do, and say what they want to say as long as it isn't harming anyone?
  15. Boy, I bet he gets a lot of dates.
    Yup yup. Which also speaks to how much I hate the corporatization/bureaucratization of this stuff, and people prioritising political correctness over kindness and respect - because contrary to innumerable takes on Twitter, political correctness and respect are not the same thing at all.
    Music Is Death and londonrain like this.
  16. How old was this person? This is a relatively common take with the "so-knee-deep-into-purity-culture-they-are-circling-right-back-into-conservative" Gen Z queers, the same crowd that is always complaining about kink at Pride, etc. The Tumblr-gender folks also loooved saying shit like this back in the day. I distinctly remember one posting "I wish a meteor would fall on that stage with all those drag queens" when Miley was performing with Ru girls at the VMAs ddd
  17. It's true, it's true.
    Let's not do this though.
    londonrain likes this.
  18. Totally.
    It’s giving very Candiace Owens is a Black Republican so suddenly Republicans think that Candiace represents all Black people. And like, plenty of cis women (TERFs) think trans women are an assault or an offense to womanhood. It doesn’t make them right.
  19. He was actually around my age- so late 20s, maybe early 30s?

    He's a hot guy with abs though, so he'll have no issue finding someone else to talk with... Aside from the fact that every gay watches Drag Race, which i'm sure he thoroughly boycotts.

    Actually, that reminds me, there's ANOTHER guy who so vehemently hates drag (And under the surface level of that: queer femme guys) that he would go on rants online about how angry he was he couldn't go to the gay bars "without there being men dressed as women every time." and how "EVERY time" he went to the bar there'd be drag shows and why couldn't he just go to enjoy being around MEN and yadda yadda. That mess was rather quickly laughingly shown the door.

    Anyways- moral of all these stories is, let's stop getting offended by things that aren't, because it causes us to fight with each other more than actually move shit forward.
    VivaForever likes this.
  20. Mr.Arroz

    Mr.Arroz Staff Member

    I don't necessarily see this as an affront, but that could be a personal fault. It's worked as a catch-all for people on Tumblr and other fellow media sites, especially in regards to TERF movements and accounts. Tumblr and its era were full of a very specific brand of dangerous and insidious thinking regarding gender and identity. Instead of a simple report, @VivaForever, can we please offer this up as a moment of understanding?

    I think many people here are trans-positive cis queer male-identifying people, and we'd like to ensure that we do our best to respect energy all around. If you're not offended or burdened, can you let us know more of your approach here? We can then use it to better teach ourselves and refrain from responses that align like those which may offend.
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