LGBTQIA+ | Page 1125 | The Popjustice Forum


Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Babylon, Aug 15, 2012.

  1. kal


    To my knowledge there’s an algorithm that detects photos that have already been uploaded, and if they got rejected previously, they get auto-rejected. There is also probably an algorithm that attempts to detect nudity or body parts and flags photos to go to human moderators based on that.
    Glitterizer likes this.
  2. Mr.Arroz

    Mr.Arroz Staff Member

    So I'm here to circle back to this and let you know the issue with this post. I affirm that you understand/see things from a very specific lens and that's overall...OK, but the whole introduction of the word "gatekeeping" is the biggest misgiving here.

    When I introduced the point that Black trans people faced transphobia and cissexism and thus fashioned terminology for themselves, the point was to drive home the intersection of gender with race, and how having to create one's own spaces leads to cultural products that are significant and unique. I understand that many white trans people tend to overlook that fact, but when I say that Black trans people created things for themselves, let me remind you, they did so because - just like all people that are barred from hegemonic influence, they were forced to build societies and spaces for themselves. I'm sure most of you have watched Pose, and yet I still think the fact that white people weren't in those Black/Latinx spaces is lost on a lot of you.

    Many of these spaces, terminologies, and cultural identities arose from being excluded by white, cis-heteronormative people. Many POC, specifically Black people created spaces for ourselves because the gate to mainstream acceptance and visibility was erected by people with power - aka white people. So this whole conversation about "gatekeeping" is without legs in the eyes of many, including me. The gate came from white people. We had to make spaces to find identity and joy. And now when we remind white people of their history in why our spaces were fashioned by and envisioned for us, we're told it's "gatekeeping".

    I am more than willing to remind white trans people that before you are trans, before you are queer, before all that - you're still white. And if you can't confront the historical truths of that, then you're not in solidarity - you're a roadblock, and your trans-ness/queerness alone does not make you an ally if you also can't interrogate the implications of your race.

    It's not gatekeeping; it's cherishing our cultural products. That is without question.
    Inland Empire, Remyky22, acl and 16 others like this.
  3. I agree with your points here. For me, language is an interesting thing because humans are so much more complex than words. There isn't always words to describe who we are. And I think the invention of those words are important. I can understand where people are coming from when they want to hold those words for themselves. I guess "gatekeeping" is just the wrong way to describe that and has that negative connotation for it, so I apologize for choosing that term.
  4. Mr.Arroz

    Mr.Arroz Staff Member

    OK, but I still don't think that you're grasping it.

    It's not about "holding words for ourselves" - it's about infusing words with context, and letting our experience shine light on that context. When we talk about queer lexicon, we talk about "realness", "tea", "throwing shade", and a lot of those things began with Black queer people before becoming frontline terms with Drag Race (aka mainstream - aka "white"). I'm going to reiterate that a big byline of queerness is illuminating that being queer is traditionally positioned as opposition to being straight - much of queerness is posited as existing in rejection or rebellion of straightness. But the intersection of that is that being Black and of color has often and still is the opposition to the privileges afforded to white people. If we're going to accept that subversion has at its roots the rejection of privilege and visibility, then it's paramount that race is accepted and absorbed as well.

    So again, I think you still need to dig deeper. It's not "taking words for our benefit" rather than "building for our own preservation". You're still scratching at the surface... and not grasping the underlying meaning.
    Sam, johnny_tsunami, acl and 11 others like this.
  5. The awful str8 dad was out again this morning, instructing his son on 'how men walk', before sashaying down the street, bouncing a partly-deflated basketball almost exactly like this:


    When I'd circled the block, he was coming back from the school run, loudly talking on his phone saying 'm8 m8 m8' incessantly. Such a douche.
  6. I will be honest, I don't think I'm intelligent enough or have a broad enough vocabulary to grasp what you're saying at the level you want me to, so there's that. I will spend some time with this, outside of this thread. I do respect the wishes of trans people when they bring up things like this - i've never used the label dolls for myself or for others because I know that that conversation comes up from it. I try not to co-op (is that the right term?) words from BIPOC queer folks, despite much of it finding it's way in the mainstream. And I follow that, I suppose, with only a surface level understanding of why that would be so important to them culturally and personally. And i'll have to take the time to learn more about the deeper meaning. Thanks for giving me some things to think about.
  7. So IML just happened this weekend in Chicago. (International Mr. Leather) which is a leather/kink convention of sorts that happens every year. My friend went, and said there was some drama this year because they were holding one-on-one seminars on different things. Learning how to whip properly, or do this or that in relation to kink. One of them was basically made for cis gay men to learn how to pleasure trans men. And boy, did the transphobia pop off on twitter about this. Transphobic cis gay men were likening this to conversion therapy, saying it's trying to lure gay men into liking vagina. Extremely problematic.
    Anyways- trans men are men and cis gay guys need to do better and grow up.
  8. Can't wait for Pride Month to remind me of all the sex I'm not having!
    Petty Mayonnaise, JMRGBY, kal and 2 others like this.
  9. I can’t wait for people to call out companies who put up the Pride flag but who also donate to anti LGBTI+ politicians.
    londonrain, Andrew and kal like this.
  10. I can't wait to buy anything with a rainbow on it. Anyone seen any cute clothing?
  11. Is anyone starting to feel that the memes or trend about complaining for brands that change their logos for Pride month is slowly crossing-over into homophobic territory?

    I used to laugh and get annoyed at corporations that only make an effort in June, like everyone else, but this morning Twitter suggested me a tweet from Elon Musk showing a meme about that, which made me feel uncomfortable. That's not something for straight people who don't have a history of allyship to complain.
    londonrain and junglefish like this.
  12. kal



    Points were made.
    Sam, aboutyounow, londonrain and 14 others like this.
  13. Nn yes. It's straight people having a kii at our expense, whether they realise it or not.
    Sam, tea, Mr Blonde and 5 others like this.
  14. Here are a couple of things that might be useful. You might want to check out or follow the works of these scholars.

    There is an article on Indonesian cinema which just came out:

    There was a Queer Asia Film Festival and Conference held in London in 2017:
  15. It's been that way for a couple of years. It gives straight people a convenient smokescreen to complain about Pride where they can claim it's about them not liking how patronizing it is, rather than them being homophobic.
    tea, joe_alouder, junglefish and 10 others like this.
  16. Exactly this. Plus, the blatantly homophobic have always jumped at attacking the corporations for putting up rainbows for June though, it’s not new.
    londonrain likes this.
  17. "values...violently enforced by the state"
    What does this mean in this context? What (western or democratic) state is violently enforcing reproduction and heterosexuality? Reproduction is not a value, it´s simply human nature in which you either partake or not.
  18. kal


    *points at Texas*
    londonrain likes this.
  19. The ones who've banned or are trying to ban abortion rights.
    londonrain and kal like this.
  20. Reproduction is not just a sperm deposit, fertilisation and giving birth. There's an entire societal, cultural, historical construct that is closely tied to governance.

    And Texas. Just off the top of my head.
    londonrain likes this.
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