Moving threads in and out of Comeback Corner

[londonrain]

Hello!

This is a place for you to ask for threads to be moved into or out of Comeback Corner and to clarify the rules. There's an element of subjectivity in determining who needs to be in this subforum and we don't all watch every thread, so please try and put any requests into this thread so that we can keep on top of them.

To prevent inconsistent decisions, the mods had a chat about how we see Comeback Corner and what belongs in it.

(EDIT: This is a set of broad guidelines that we agreed on at the time. We do, of course, reserve the right to create exceptions in specific cases - and if we do that, you're obviously welcome to ask why that is, but ultimately this is literally a decision about which subforum a thread goes in on an Internet music forum, so it's not that deep.)

Comeback Corner is not:

• a place for acts that just haven’t released anything for a while (provided it's less than 10 years) but haven’t actually ‘retired’ or broken up (e.g. Goldfrapp, Rihanna, All Saints, Christina Aguilera)
• a place for acts that are still releasing but don't have the same public profile any more due to being older and/or less popular (e.g. No Angels, En Vogue, the Pussycat Dolls, Dubstar)
• for album-specific threads relating to albums that have finished their promotion cycles (those threads remain in P&J but are locked once their promotion cycles have ended or a new album has been released, and further discussion of those older albums then goes into the act's General Discussion thread)

Comeback Corner is:

• for General Discussion threads for acts who have died and are not in the middle of a posthumous release cycle for a new studio album (e.g. Whitney Houston, George Michael, Aaliyah, Viola Beach)
• for General Discussion threads for acts who have said they are no longer making music, have otherwise actively stepped back from making music, or have simply not released any music either as a lead or a featured artist for ten years or longer (e.g. Britney Spears, Billie Piper, Billy Joel, Phil Collins)
• for other threads relating to acts who fall into one of the above two categories (e.g. "Forgotten late 90s/early 00s bops")

As it wasn't necessarily consistent before, some of our previous decisions will not have followed the above but we're moving threads around now to fit these rules. If you see a thread that is in the wrong subforum based on the rules above, please post here.

 

[AcerBenII]

Perhaps the forum should be renamed too then? If they're no longer making music or dead, then they're not making a Comeback haha.

 

[londonrain]

Perhaps the forum should be renamed too then? If they're no longer making music or dead, then they're not making a Comeback haha.

Well, the "no longer making music" bit implies that if they do release something it will be a comeback, whereas someone who's simply not released an album in a few years isn't really making a comeback.

(I agree about acts who are dead - it's always been a bit weird seeing names like Whitney in a subforum called Comeback Corner - but the mods don't have the ability to rename subforums, so here we are.)

 

[AcerBenII]

Well, the "no longer making music" bit implies that if they do release something it will be a comeback, whereas someone who's simply not released an album in a few years isn't really making a comeback.

(I agree about acts who are dead - it's always been a bit weird seeing names like Whitney in a subforum called Comeback Corner - but the mods don't have the ability to rename subforums, so here we are.)

Surely acts like No Angels and The Pussycat Dolls were away long enough that their new releases are a "comeback" though?

I mean it doesn't matter.. I understand the logic of active acts all being in the same forum and good to have consistency. Maybe a little worried that some of the threads by retro acts will get a bit buried because the P&J forum moves a little faster. We'll see.

 

[londonrain]

Surely acts like No Angels and The Pussycat Dolls were away long enough that their new releases are a "comeback" though?

I mean it doesn't matter.. I understand the logic of active acts all being in the same forum and good to have consistency. Maybe a little worried that some of the threads by retro acts will get a bit buried because the P&J forum moves a little faster. We'll see.

I guess the point is that once an act actually has made (or are making) their comeback they can live in P&J, which is meant to house threads for acts who are active in music. I appreciate that makes "Comeback Corner" a bit of a misnomer but we can't change that at the moment.

 

[berserkboi]

Always love your efforts to be proactive and transparent with decisions @londonrain! So glad to have you moderating! XXX

 

[soratami]

It's great to have these guidelines spelled out like this. I always found it a bit annoying when certain threads got moved into the Comeback Corner as a joke or as "punishment", as that's not really the purpose of this sub-forum. Hopefully that's something that won't be happening anymore.

Also

Comeback Corner is not:

• a place for acts that are still releasing but don't have the same public profile any more due to being older and/or less popular (e.g. No Angels, En Vogue, the Pussycat Dolls, Dubstar)

It did feel like sometimes the basis for an artist's thread being in the main forum or the Comeback Corner was simply the artist's age (or in the case of a group, if they'd been around for a long time), regardless of if they were actually still actively releasing music, which honestly seemed a bit ageist. And ageism is already enough of an issue in pop music without PJ having to fuel it, so this is definitely a change for the better in my opinion.

 

[londonrain]

Yes, the ageism point is definitely one of the things we want to address with these rules. If you see any threads that have fallen victim to this, please do let us know. We’re trying to catch them as we spot them but I’m aware we don’t see everything if it isn’t reported!

 

[hamicle]

Think of it less as “Comeback Corner” and more “Come Back!* Corner”.

(* death notwithstanding)

 

[londonrain]

Think of it less as “Comeback Corner” and more “Come Back!* Corner”.

(* death notwithstanding)

If we ever are able to rename the subforums, “Come Back! Corner” has my vote.

 

[An Insider]

Thank you for these guidelines @londonrain !

Personally, I think deceased acts should be moved to a separate sub-forum dddd but renaming the sub-forum works, too. I don’t know which approach is easier, but I find lumping “Comeback” acts with deceased artists a bit strange.

 

[JamieHT]

Well I’m glad there seems to have been thought about this. It was my contesting a certain decision that led to lots of problems.

I would like to make a suggestion therefore (and I don’t know if it’s possible) that these decisions should be put to a committee to avoid the mental anguish such a decision caused me last year. (Yes I’m sure people may laugh that a forum online caused me mental health issues, but it really did. I will happily go into detail with one of the moderators (or all of them), but I hope this really is a turning point.)

 

[londonrain]

Well I’m glad there seems to have been thought about this. It was my contesting a certain decision that led to lots of problems.

I would like to make a suggestion therefore (and I don’t know if it’s possible) that these decisions should be put to a committee to avoid the mental anguish such a decision caused me last year. (Yes I’m sure people may laugh that a forum online caused me mental health issues, but it really did. I will happily go into detail with one of the moderators (or all of them), but I hope this really is a turning point.)

We’re making a conscious effort to discuss it among the moderators where there’s something that might be contentious without making it into a formal committee process. Let’s give it a while to see how that approach goes before we shift to something more formal.

 

[manloveuk]

I rarely get involved in the politics - just here to chat about the music - but I will say I think this thread is an excellent idea, so thank you. At times I have been a tad baffled by moves to (more than from) Comeback Corner, but rarely does it bother me enough to have an opinion.

One such move though, was the recent move of All Saints into Comeback Corner... I'd only last week as part of the ongoing chat in that thread noted wishing they'd get round to delivering a new album, but acknowledged the last one was literally a few years ago, and even in the time since they've put out Girls On Film, Message In A Bottle with Sting and like everyone else have had to lie low for this last year, so was surprised to see within a few days the thread had been moved to Comeback Corner.

By the definitions of each forum above, All Saints are points #1 and #2 of what Comeback Corner is not for, so perhaps that's one decision that would benefit from review.

My only other note, and it's a minor aesthetic/practical one really so no biggie, but Comeback Corner to me seems the second most thriving section of all (I may be wrong), so why it sits below the rather more niche sections on K-Pop, X-Factor and Eurovision I don't know, and it's no slight on those areas, I just don't personally agree with it.

All that said, I love the tone and connectedness in the Comeback Corner regulars and any threads there are less likely to get lost in the melee so happy with whatever really.

Most of all, again, thanks for providing a space where we can at least have this discussion. It's a great decision.

 

[londonrain]

I rarely get involved in the politics - just here to chat about the music - but I will say I think this thread is an excellent idea, so thank you. At times I have been a tad baffled by moves to (more than from) Comeback Corner, but rarely does it bother me enough to have an opinion.

One such move though, was the recent move of All Saints into Comeback Corner... I'd only last week as part of the ongoing chat in that thread noted wishing they'd get round to delivering a new album, but acknowledged the last one was literally a few years ago, and even in the time since they've put out Girls On Film, Message In A Bottle with Sting and like everyone else have had to lie low for this last year, so was surprised to see within a few days the thread had been moved to Comeback Corner.

By the definitions of each forum above, All Saints are points #1 and #2 of what Comeback Corner is not for, so perhaps that's one decision that would benefit from review.

My only other note, and it's a minor aesthetic/practical one really so no biggie, but Comeback Corner to me seems the second most thriving section of all (I may be wrong), so why it sits below the rather more niche sections on K-Pop, X-Factor and Eurovision I don't know, and it's no slight on those areas, I just don't personally agree with it.

All that said, I love the tone and connectedness in the Comeback Corner regulars and any threads there are less likely to get lost in the melee so happy with whatever really.

Most of all, again, thanks for providing a space where we can at least have this discussion. It's a great decision.

I fully agree about All Saints - I was the one to move it originally and I moved it back last night, right after I opened this thread.

I also agree that Comeback Corner is a very active space and deserves to be higher up (certainly over the X Factor subforum!) but unfortunately we can’t control the order of the subforum list. When the new mods were appointed last year Peter mentioned an overhaul of the subforums to come as part of the planned migration of the whole forum to a new server, but unfortunately we don’t know when that will happen. (Peter also suggested that perhaps we should shift to just having all the General Discussion threads in one subforum and all the album-specific threads in another, so that we don’t have to make subjective calls about what is worthy of Comeback Corner.)

 

[manloveuk]

I fully agree about All Saints - I was the one to move it originally and I moved it back last night, right after I opened this thread.

I also agree that Comeback Corner is a very active space and deserves to be higher up (certainly over the X Factor subforum!) but unfortunately we can’t control the order of the subforum list. When the new mods were appointed last year Peter mentioned an overhaul of the subforums to come as part of the planned migration of the whole forum to a new server, but unfortunately we don’t know when that will happen. (Peter also suggested that perhaps we should shift to just having all the General Discussion threads in one subforum and all the album-specific threads in another, so that we don’t have to make subjective calls about what is worthy of Comeback Corner.)

Thank you for all of that ... owning it and rectifying it re: All Saints is honourable and very reassuring.

The separate place for general discussion and album campaign considerations is not something I've really thought about before, but very interesting.

And I'm pleased to see there's some thinking about the sequencing of the sections, but fully appreciate the dilemma in terms of it awaiting a planned migration etc. I've no idea how these things operate, but I imagine it to be no easy or small task.

Thanks again, and well done on giving space for this conversation.

 

[V3RYP05H]

@londonrain continuously proving to be the best Mod here!

Love this thread, love the clarification. I will miss the “safe space” atmosphere of the Comeback Corner but it is the right thing to do.

Think of it less as “Comeback Corner” and more “Come Back!* Corner”.

(* death notwithstanding)

I mean, a lot of people would want said acts to come back (to life) too.

 

[londonrain]

Maybe it’s better described as Reminiscence Corner? Not as snappy, though.

But I agree, @V3RYP05H - I think a lot of us would love to see the likes of Whitney and George come back if it were possible!

 

[paullypaul]

I’m not a frequent poster here so would certainly not expect to have any input in this. but I do love visiting Comeback Corner to read. I have a permanently open webpage on my phone for the BBC4 TOTP thread as I love to see the chat surrounding those. I would partake in that thread myself but I’m always watching the episodes several weeks after they are broadcast and am therefore about 15 pages behind everybody else!

Anyway I’ve always thought of comeback corner as being a place for “radio 2” type acts, with the main P&J forum being “Radio 1”. I have to admit that I’m of a certain age and a lot of the artists in P&J are ones I’m not too familiar with. I would occasionally venture over there for Madonna or Kylie gossip but that’s about it. I liked that split as I’ve always found comeback corner a lot more relaxed and friendly. But I get that things need to change so will see how it goes with the new format. It’s nice to know that so much thought has been put into this.

 

[londonrain]

Radio 1 is notoriously ageist so I definitely don’t want P&J to be the equivalent of Radio 1 dddd.