Pet Shop Boys - New Album "Elysium" (September 2012) | Page 12 | The Popjustice Forum

Pet Shop Boys - New Album "Elysium" (September 2012)

Discussion in 'Pop & Justice' started by MikeyC, May 6, 2012.

  1. Because of The Winner being the most disappointing Pet Shop Boys lead single of all times, I'm left frustrated and play Yes and Etc. all day. Amazing album. Love etc. : what a song ! And what a lead single ! So sad I don't even have the will to buy The Winner on Itunes today...

    On another note : Etienne's comparison with Go West makes The Winner even worse. I know a lot of fans don't rate Go West very high, but I do love it and think it was a genius move from the band at the time, because it made their public bigger, wider, with an ultra specific / niche disco number. A complete tour de force audience wise. And a beautiful and touching gay hymn with amazing lyrics : let's not forget the Aids context in 1992 : "(Go West) Life is peaceful there / (Go West) In the open air / (Go West) Where the skies are blue" may sound cheesy, but when your friends are dying because of Aids, it's... well, let's say that this song always makes me cry 20 years later. Anyway, we're far from The Winner's MOR sound and insignificant lyrics.
     
  2. Each to his own taste, but for me "Yes" isn't aging well at all. I recently re-compiled my personal Pet Shop Boys Top 50 / 80 and I felt no need to include Yes songs, other than All over the world, Beautiful people and Vulnerable.

    Love etc. - I quite like it - is more a tune than a song. It's Neil singing a couple of different vocal lines over a backing track that hardly changes. The way it used to be: same recipe. I don't care about that style of songwriting, but I find it remarkable how many people slaughtered Release (and its lead single), despite a similar way of songwriting and song structures.

    I also don't understand how somebody can complain about MOR sound a lyrics for a lead single, while praising Yes. You're not telling me that DYSMC? and Pandemonium are examples of brilliant songwriting with thoughtful, in-depth, layered lyrics, are you? DYSMC? is PSB by numbers and Pandemonium was written as a single for Kylie Minogue.

    Really: I can understand your criticism, but Pet Shop Boys are (still) trying to be a pop band, trying to achieve commercial success. That's their choice. I prefer their more artistic side, but this is what they do nowadays. In order to get great stuff like 'The Most Incredible Thing' and fantastic new album tracks and b-sides (every new Tennant/Lowe song is a gift), you have to cope with crappy 'hit attempts' like Together every now and then.
     
  3. Sorry, but the "in-depth" / "artistic side" vs "written for Kylie Minogue" opposition has no meaning for me and "brilliant songwritting" does not suppose "in-depth, layered lyrics" at all. I don't blame The Winner lyrics for their lack of in-depth meaning, but for their lack of everything : wit, ideas, meaning or stupidity... A simple "I'm the winner / You're the loser" that somebody invented in this thread would have been enough, like the "(Don't have to be) beautiful but it helps". Or a nice rhyme. Or... anything but those dull lyrics.
    And about the MOR accusation : it may sound stupid, but it's not the sound itself, not really the lyrics, but the melody that sounds MOR to me : dull, simple in a bad way and a little vulgar. Ugh.
     
  4. I think Yes is completely awesome record. The only pfft thing about it was the single choices.
    Did You See Me Coming & Beautiful People? I beg of you. They're like doorstops that hold the entrances to let their army of amazing singles walk through.
    Pandemonium would have been camp as tits and King Of Rome, Legacy, The Way It Used To Be or More Than A Dream would have been far superior in my opinion.
    How someone can have a top 80 PSB song list and not include at least three songs from Yes seems tres odd to me!
     
  5. I totally disagree with everything you've said - and I think all of Farnaby's points are spot on. Yes still sounds fresh.
     
  6. Agreed! 'Yes' still sounds great, especially 'The Way...' and 'More Than A Dream'.
     
  7. jtm

    jtm

    Yes is okay, but DYSMC? was not really good.

    Stll amazing though: Winner. As always it will look and sound better to most people in hindsight like three years from now.
     
  8. Did You See Me Coming is actually in my top 10 singles by them!

    I guess one thing that can be said about their music is that no one fan can rarely agree on what's good and bad. Or not bad as such, as they very rarely do bad.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2012
  9. jtm

    jtm

    Really? I thought it was a bit dull and would have preferred Pandemonium or All Over The World. It did get them a lot of airplay in certain countries though.
     
  10. DYSMC sounds like an Electronic track. Therefore it is perfection.
     
  11. DYSMC? is among the three worst single choices ever, together with Numb and IDK. The latter completely ruined the potential Nightlife had. DYSMC? is a typical Pet Shop Boys song, which is exactly why it's a very poor single choice. It's a safe bet; a song that was never going to convince anybody to buy a Pet Shop Boys album.

    "Beautiful people", which was only a low-profile single in Germany, at least has a different sound, regardless what you think of the song. That may appeal to a new audience; Pet Shop Boys fans will buy the single anyway. I think it's a big mistake to think that fan favourites should also be released as singles. If you choose to promote the album by releasing a single, you should pick a song that will get a new audience interested in buying the album. A fan favourite like "The way it used to be" would have been a horrible single choice; it's nearly 5 minutes long and has no radio appeal at all.

    Perhaps you misunderstood me: my Top 80 currently includes exactly 3 songs from Yes (the ones I mentioned), with "This used to be the future" bubbling under, probably followed by "Building a wall" and "Love etc.".
     
  12. I don't want to fight your opinion or convince you to change it, but I just fail to understand why you labeled "Winner" their worst lead single ever, with your main argument of calling the melody MOR. Have you ever listened to the song structure and melody of "Home and dry" for instance? Are you really sure that its melody is so much better than "Winner"?

    You called the Winner lyrics insignificant. Fine, but what's the significance of lyrics like "Home and dryiiiiaiiiayayyyyyy" (four times in a row). I could discuss the song structure and chorus lyrics of several other PSB singles here as well (IDK, I'm with stupid, Together)... let's not go there.

    Instead, I will post a fragment from the arjanwrites music blog, discussing:
    Fitting right in with Britain's Olympic spirit, "Winner" is wonderfully joyful tune that perfectly showcases Pet Shop Boys' refreshed state of mind. Whether you're competing, in love or simply trying to make it through another day, the song carries a universal meaning and conveys that everyone who perseveres against the odds, loves and lives in the moment is a true winner. And even when life is getting you down, Neil Tennant comforts and reminds listeners that "in desperation you get inspiration," which captures the overarching sentiment of the song.
    Source: http://www.arjanwrites.com/arjanwrites/2012/07/pet-shop-boys-winner.html

    I really liked this description of the song. Perhaps it's all about (not) hearing what you (don't) want to hear...
     
  13. Well, you have every right to disagree with me. My main problem with Yes is not its sound, by the way. Most songs were produced very well. It's just the quality of the songs that's below par. And mind you: "below par" is not the same as bad. Yes is still a rather good album. But in my opinion, several other Pet Shop Boys albums are better.

    I agree with that comment for sure. And it shows that fan opinions are a very bad guideline when it comes to picking singles.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2012
  14. You're a fan, just like everybody else posting in here! So I hope you're including yourself in the 'very bad guideline' category also.
     
  15. What other PSB song does DYSMC sound like? It sounds like their collabs with Electronic (courtesy Marr) more than any PSB song.
     
  16. Well, I hope for the Boys that EMI's strategy (now we know that The Winner was not their choice for first single) will work and that millions of people will know / remember the Pet Shop Boys as "the band that did a great tune for the 2012 Olympics that sounded a little like Queen, but more electronic, you know, and less Freddy Mercury, obviously"... But as far as I'm concerned, I'll focus on the 3 b-sides, hoping they'll be at the same level of quality of their b-sides in general.

    But about the singles strategy : yes, Did You See Me Coming (and Minimal), both very Pet Shop Boys songs, have failed charts wise... but Numb and Love Etc., not very Pet Shop Boys (or less, at least) songs have failed too. So really there's no good or bad method for a 30 years old pop band, only good or bad songs and The Winner for my ears obviously belongs to etc.

    (I have a theory about Home and Dry : with another intro (ie. without the Police), fans wouldn't have been so shocked by the song's simplicity and would have been more inclined to take the song for what it's worth : a great emotional elegy about longing. "There's a plane at JFK..." Simplicity is a great achievement and art, especially for such an "unsimple" band as Pet Shop Boys, but it has nothing to do with blandness and dullness...)
     
  17. Certainly; I'm not trying to convince you that my favourite songs should be released as singles. I'm trying to mention some arguments why the average listener might like a Pet Shop Boys song. Catchy, simple lyrics, easy to sing along, etc...

    I think it's a typical Pet Shop Boys song. Its chorus (as well as the verse) chords are rather similar to those of Being boring and New York City boy.
     
  18. Did You See Me Coming? is a very good song, and yes, a very PSB-sounding one.

    To be honest, I don't think that really matters - they're hardly going to pull in new listeners at this stage regardless of what singles they release.
     
  19. I quite like Winner. Even if its a bit too "pop" sounding for me, I like my PSB to be more electro.
     
  20. SockMonkey

    SockMonkey Guest

    We do? Where was this mentioned?

    I just can't like Winner. It plods. For a song about winning, it can't really be bothered, which makes me want to not bother. I'm desperately searching for the hidden irony or subtext in the lyrics which is hopefully some big "fuck off" to the whole Olympics nonsense but I'm struggling to see it. I can only hope they've deliberately written something as bland and cliche-ridden as this to make a point.
     
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