Discussion in 'TV + Film' started by Mikey1701, Nov 2, 2015.
Boldly going where no vineyard has gone before.
Still betting on the TNG fanbase going apeshit when nobody else from TNG shows up.
Trek fans will literally complain about anything these days. It's honestly embarrassing at this point. Remember when there was an uproar about the visuals of Discovery not being identical to the cardboard TOS sets? The mind actually boggles.
You can bet that they'll be up in arms about the lack of other TNG cast members appearing despite being repeatedly told that nobody from the series is set to appear in the show. Sir Patrick has said so, the writers have said so, the producers have said so, Dame Marina Sirtis has said so (multiple times), Johnathan Frakes has said so... but you just know some butt hurt fan boy living in his mother's basement will kick up a right fuss and set off the more vitriolic sect of the fanbase off.
I'd prefer there are no TNG appearances (it'll only create more of the Trek small universe syndrome, which Discovery suffers from already) but I can see Frakes popping in for a small role. He's just directed the block of EPS 3 - 4 and while there could easily have filmed scenes for use later in the season.
The show will be much more interesting giving us new Trek characters for Picard and the audience to get to know. The rumoured cast is quite big and diverse, so the last thing the show needs is stuffing in pointless cameos.
Small universe syndrome is the main reason I can't be arsed with the novels. I have lived in the same city as someone I worked with 18 years ago and not once have we ever run into each other again, yet, there are billions of people in Starfleet working across hundreds of thousands of cubic light years in thousands of shps and stations and planets and we always randomly encounter people from previous episodes.
"Equinox" pushed it with me, having a schoolmate of B'Elanna's just happen to bethe first officer. It was tedious enough when someone else B'Elanna was in academy with, just happened to know Paris and Kim too.
I'm still lighting every sexy plasma ghost prayer candle for Beverly to appear.
I understand the logic behind having familiar characters interact in the novels but it can really take you out of the narrative. There was one novel (Star Trek does The West Wing) which was littered with cameos from established TV characters and as much as I adored the book there were moments that I simply could not fathom. Like why Queen Janeway would appear on a segment about something totally unrelated to Voyager.
With that said there are some novels that steer clear of that trope and there is some fabulous writing. The Crimson Shadow is one (the scenes with Garak interacting with the Enterprise crew are minimal)- it’s an incredible read about Cardassja and features a wholly new protagonist.... and Garak.
Always a win.
I personally dont care if none of the other cast members from TNG show up. Just give me my Romulans, Cardassians, Klingons, etc. And for fuck sake discuss the origin of the Borg already. I also hope the Borg return. Highly doubt Captain Janeway destroyed them to extinction. There's probably more transwarp hubs throughout the galaxy. They're kind of the roaches of the galaxies. They also need to stop humanizing certain species. They humanized the Klingons, Cardassians, the Borg, hell even Species 8472 which is a damn shame because 8472 could have been so bad ass had they remained the merciless evil xenomorphic aliens. If they introduce a new villainous species I hope they are evil to their core.
I never understood why they suddenly have Species 8472 shapeshifting abilities in that Season 5 episode. If there is one race that should have been seen more it was 8472. They had such a strong introduction at the end of Season 3 and “Prey” was a great Season 4 follow up but after that they were largely abandoned in favour of evil bin men (the Malon).
Finally getting round to season 2 of Discovery
I forgot how much they really like a lens flare
That shape-shifting episode makes no sense at all. I think 8472 were fine with just the two-parter and "Prey". "In the Flesh" just felt like an excuse to bring them back, but not an inspired one at all.
Exactly. It was so obviously an excuse to get the cast on location and it blatant “OMG look they could be home”. 8472 were shoe horned into a plot that didn’t require them.
For all the attention to detail Species 8472 had employed in their recreation of Earth, they failed to notice that the actual real world planet itself was on the other side of the galaxy, presumably just as far away in fluidic space dimensions. That's the huuuge plot hole that ruptures that episode.
For a few years I thought they got it just right with the Hirogen. 5 episodes, a complex enemy, developed over a loose arc in the mid-season four, then bye, we've passed out of their space onto new ground. But of course Voyager couldn't help themselves and brought them back for season 6 and 7 because fuck internal consistency.
I always assumed they could open rifts from fluidic space more or less wherever they wanted. And/or their ships are just really fast. Bear in mind both post-Scorpion appearances of 8472 take place after Kes' 10 year gift, so somehow they must be able to traverse large distances much faster than Voyager.
They did get it right with the Hirogen. They created the comm stations that linked all the way back to the Alpha Quadrant that led the Doctor on to the Prometheus. And Chakotay does at one point say they are a nomadic species around the same time. They could theoretically be spread all over the DQ.
The problem with that is that it’s a throwaway line uttered by an utterly uninteresting character. I had forgotten all about it until I rewatched Season 4 a couple of weeks back.
The Hirogen were okay but not as tough as they were written to be (got their asses beat by 8472 and a Bajoran hologram). I did love the hirogen Tony Todd played though. He was alert, intimidating and unexpectedly funny. Tony Todd was also hilarious as Kurn especially in Sons of Mogh where he so desperately wants to die in honor but keeps getting revived.
Thing is, the network was disrupted at the end of "Hunters", so they couldn't use it to communicate across their diaspora anymore, so how did the Hirogen in season 7 receive the instructions from season 4 Hirogen 20,000 LY away to create holographic tech, impliment it, and then kick the arse out of it in the space of almost three years.
I had never thought of it like that before and I have to be honest, you’ve raised an excellent point! Before that, my only issue with the Flesh & Blood TV movie/two parter was the religious fundamentalism of Iden feeling tacked on to the latter half. I don’t think it needed it and the Doctor could have realised Iden was unstable/had an unstable matrix some other way.
Even with that and the point you made, F&B is still one of my favourite episodes of the final series of Voyager along with Body & Soul. Jeri Ryan is fucking hysterical in that episode.
Another final series of Voyager plot hole.... in Endgame... Seven clearly knows about the transwarp hubs because she says there are six of them in the Delta Quadrant.... so why didn’t she mention them before? You’d of thought she would have done the moment she and Queen Janeway became close.
Of course the writers could never decide how transwarp worked in Voyager. They could WITHOUT a transwarp coil in Day Of Honour, then they couldn’t in Dark Frontier, then Endgame showed it differently (structures inside the corridors) and then there was Threshhold where Paris hit Warp 10, evolved, kidnapped Janeway, devolved into a lizard and had babies with her.....
I presume that transwarp is slower than Warp 10. It took about a minute of screen time for them to travel 35,000 years to Earth in "Endgame". Warp 10 would have got them there (and everywhere else) instantly.
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