Star Trek
- Thread starter Mikey1701
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God, that would be tragic. I don't dislike SNW but being stuck with that as the only live action show would really bore me. Not knocking the show, on all fronts its very competent and delivers exactly on its storytelling but it feels like the lowest level of ambition you could get from a Trek show.
I feel like a Picard spinoff is a lock, if s3 keeps going down this track. I'm afraid (well, only for you hardcore DISCO fans) that the 31st century is gonna be a distant memory.
It makes sense; all the great things they were doing on Discovery (in terms of progressive characters) can be replicated on a 25th century show; all the good will engendered from fans re: the temporal setting (and possibly continuing VOY and DS9 storylines) cannot, in the alternate case.
SNW and Picard spinoff would be the safest bets for Paramount, in terms of return on investment.
It makes sense; all the great things they were doing on Discovery (in terms of progressive characters) can be replicated on a 25th century show; all the good will engendered from fans re: the temporal setting (and possibly continuing VOY and DS9 storylines) cannot, in the alternate case.
SNW and Picard spinoff would be the safest bets for Paramount, in terms of return on investment.
I agree, I think the 32nd Century time setting is going to be shuttered off with Discovery and I highly doubt we're going to see it again with Paramount being this picky and brutal now. I didn't mind what Discovery did with the period, they actually built a world that was kind of interesting but there's not enough bankable brand power there.
They'd be far better off doing a 25th Century series, load it with new characters and add in some familiar faces here or there from the Berman era. There's nothing a show like that couldn't do that Discovery was also doing, with far better writing and grasp of the franchise.
Let SNW be the somewhat predictable Trek staple and let a new 25th Century series build on the 90s Golden Era but with a weighting towards new characters. Not ideal as I still feel Discovery was the best bet to grab new fans but we are where we are now.
Did you finish s2? Cuz it's not just "this season" he's not in...
Yeah but they can get round things like that.
Just watched PICARD ep 3 &4 last night...sadly, I was less impressed with these than episodes 1 & 2.
While
were mind-blowingly amazing, others such as
and
were not.
Still interested in seeing for whom Vadic is working (my watch group had differing theories based on different interpretations of what we actually saw happen on screen!), but...kinda disappointed to be honest, overall.
Shaw remains my snarky captain daddy, however.
While
the inclusion of the CHANGELINGS!!!! aaaghhh!!!
Riker being a total pansy and Picard being aggressively hawkish
the Farpoint jellyfish babies
Still interested in seeing for whom Vadic is working (my watch group had differing theories based on different interpretations of what we actually saw happen on screen!), but...kinda disappointed to be honest, overall.
Shaw remains my snarky captain daddy, however.
Utterly loved this episode. The perfect balance of classic Treks problem solved by debate and smart, measured process and modern Treks more emotional baggage drama but rooted in a much more restrained way.
Then bringing both those elements together in a really elegant way to resolve the crisis. Great stuff. Perfect wrap up of this act and a nice reset of where we go next.
Then bringing both those elements together in a really elegant way to resolve the crisis. Great stuff. Perfect wrap up of this act and a nice reset of where we go next.
Episode five I'm gonna need time to process. Some moments I've been waiting over 25 years for.
I'm over the moon. And I'm fucking heartbroken.
An episode that’ll stick with the fanbase for quite some time I suspect. A real gut punch but what a powerful and moving way to tie off a long running story and also move this season along so elegantly.
You know you’ve watched something special when you’re still thinking about it hours later. This season really is incredible.
You know you’ve watched something special when you’re still thinking about it hours later. This season really is incredible.
This episode was EMOTIONAL, and beautifully acted. Like that is a payoff decades in the making and I found it to be heartbreaking and just so memorable. Wow.
Okay, so, I have some questions and immediate thoughts:
Okay, so, I have some questions and immediate thoughts:
The Daystrom Station AI that Worf was talking about... That's clearly going to be Moriarty, huh?
Also, if Changlings hate Solids so much, why would they want to shapeshift into them down to the damn organs... y'know, aside from to cause mayhem. Bev's "It's evolution" thing I don't really buy... It seems intentional. Also are they retconning some things too? Because in DS9 they could shapeshift into *any*thing, Not just people. It seems they're making it very specific that these changelings only can shift into people. Also, was regenerating specifically in a designated pot really a thing? Like i'm pretty sure they can go regenerate anywhere... I don't know why destroying a pot would be required.
I really hope some/a DS9 character(s) show up!
And I really hope whatever payoff happens with Jack's mystery is good... Because I am cautious as it could easily be that whatever is going on with him is stupid.
I can't wait to see Raffi and Seven reunited. Spinoff with Seven, Raffi AND Worf, please.
Also, if Changlings hate Solids so much, why would they want to shapeshift into them down to the damn organs... y'know, aside from to cause mayhem. Bev's "It's evolution" thing I don't really buy... It seems intentional. Also are they retconning some things too? Because in DS9 they could shapeshift into *any*thing, Not just people. It seems they're making it very specific that these changelings only can shift into people. Also, was regenerating specifically in a designated pot really a thing? Like i'm pretty sure they can go regenerate anywhere... I don't know why destroying a pot would be required.
I really hope some/a DS9 character(s) show up!
And I really hope whatever payoff happens with Jack's mystery is good... Because I am cautious as it could easily be that whatever is going on with him is stupid.
I can't wait to see Raffi and Seven reunited. Spinoff with Seven, Raffi AND Worf, please.
Seven mentioned in the episode that Starfleet requires its personnel to pass through some sort of imaging chamber when they report to an assignment. My guess is that these changelings developed the ability to mimic organs and DNA to get around this.I have no doubt that they can also morph into anything and just people- but there’s been no time to focus on that because of the laser point precision with which the story has unfolded. The Changelings on the Titan would need to shapeshift into people to get around. Somebody would notice if they were oozing out of vents- that ship is always crowded.
I had to watch it again before I could sleep on Thursday night. It was all I could think about when I got up on Friday and went to work the next morning. I had to explain it to my department colleagues how much of a blow it was to teenage me. What a fucking episode.
I YAAASSSSed like never before when the POV changed to show Ro's face. I've never loved a Star Trek character like I love Ro Laren. Not even the others that are high on my favourites list: Jadzia Dax, Odo, Garak... Picard, come close. I hung onto the belief that important franchise characters don't just die in expository dialogue in other shows to keep her alive in my head canon. No matter what DS9 and Voyager said about what happened to the Maquis, there's no way Berman would have authorised those shows to kill off Ro offscreen. Michael Piller and Jeri Taylor would also have sent memos the second they got wind of it, even if they weren't in the franchise by the time the Maquis storyline was ended.
Riker standing up for Ro is spot on how Riker would be. He respected the fuck out of Ro, even if he had to come down on her relentlessly time after time. I think some fans in the comments seems surprised by this, but repeating Riker's attitude to Ro from the transporter room in "Ensign Ro" is the kind of reset Voyager would have done.
One complaint - that wig was a bit too... noticable. I notice a few people online not really happy with her nose makeup, but I think they tried to do a hybrid of Ro's original nose design that was a bit more elaborate and the more simpler DS9 style nose Ro had by "Preemptive Strike" that didn't have the brow parts.
Then Matalas expertly played me, please don't say you brought her back *just* to have her be a changeling. Now I really get why he's been saying it had to be Ro for this episode, to get the "conspiracy thriller" gears to work. I can't think of anyone else from TNG that could have been done with.
The chatharsis of the two-hander bar scene. I've wanted to see that happen since I was 14. I was a bit frustrated with Michelle's stiff acting choices in the interrogation scenes up til then (which on rewatch is definitely to give you the idea that maybe she's a changeling), but as soon as Ro's tears came across the bar, Michelle was definitely Ro Laren again. If you've seen her in some other things, Michelle Forbes really can do tears like nobody else. There's just something about her eyes that sparkle as soon as they get wet, as far back as when she played Timicin's daughter in "Half a Life" before she got the Ro Laren part.
"You broke my heart" "And you broke mine" got me right in the feels.
When Ro and Picard embraced and the tears came again, I was crying too. It's one of the most universal parts of living your life is disappointing someone who's opinion on you you really care about. Sometimes they understand, sometimes they never do. Sometimes you never find out.
Then Matalas played me a second time. My brain started thinking ahead to later in the season, could we see Ro again, maybe in a crowd scene with all the other legacy TNG cast. Oh what a moment that would be! Only for that to be destroyed within seconds and it became immediately obvious that she wasn't getting out of this.
More fans in the comments comments have been written that here's Picard again, killing off more legacy characters, but excuse me, that death was earned. Ro is pivotal to this season. Ro isn't just a one-and-out, she's been in the background since the season opener, and now with her earring data, she's kicking off the rest of the season in earnest. Her death just upped the stakes organically at the mid-point of the season narrative. I haven't felt this energised by a mid-season gear change since Dukat pulled the rug from under the Federation in the "In Purgartory's Shadow"/"By Inferno's Light" two-parter on Deep Space Nine's season five. You can't say that about Hugh's death. If you remove his death scene, season 1 plays out the exact same. If you remove Icheb's death, same, except you have to come up with a different excuse to get Seven into a two-rifle phaser blast scene.
One last thing. Picard as the Intrepid burned in space behind him. That is all.
Riker standing up for Ro is spot on how Riker would be. He respected the fuck out of Ro, even if he had to come down on her relentlessly time after time. I think some fans in the comments seems surprised by this, but repeating Riker's attitude to Ro from the transporter room in "Ensign Ro" is the kind of reset Voyager would have done.
One complaint - that wig was a bit too... noticable. I notice a few people online not really happy with her nose makeup, but I think they tried to do a hybrid of Ro's original nose design that was a bit more elaborate and the more simpler DS9 style nose Ro had by "Preemptive Strike" that didn't have the brow parts.
Then Matalas expertly played me, please don't say you brought her back *just* to have her be a changeling. Now I really get why he's been saying it had to be Ro for this episode, to get the "conspiracy thriller" gears to work. I can't think of anyone else from TNG that could have been done with.
The chatharsis of the two-hander bar scene. I've wanted to see that happen since I was 14. I was a bit frustrated with Michelle's stiff acting choices in the interrogation scenes up til then (which on rewatch is definitely to give you the idea that maybe she's a changeling), but as soon as Ro's tears came across the bar, Michelle was definitely Ro Laren again. If you've seen her in some other things, Michelle Forbes really can do tears like nobody else. There's just something about her eyes that sparkle as soon as they get wet, as far back as when she played Timicin's daughter in "Half a Life" before she got the Ro Laren part.
"You broke my heart" "And you broke mine" got me right in the feels.
When Ro and Picard embraced and the tears came again, I was crying too. It's one of the most universal parts of living your life is disappointing someone who's opinion on you you really care about. Sometimes they understand, sometimes they never do. Sometimes you never find out.
Then Matalas played me a second time. My brain started thinking ahead to later in the season, could we see Ro again, maybe in a crowd scene with all the other legacy TNG cast. Oh what a moment that would be! Only for that to be destroyed within seconds and it became immediately obvious that she wasn't getting out of this.
More fans in the comments comments have been written that here's Picard again, killing off more legacy characters, but excuse me, that death was earned. Ro is pivotal to this season. Ro isn't just a one-and-out, she's been in the background since the season opener, and now with her earring data, she's kicking off the rest of the season in earnest. Her death just upped the stakes organically at the mid-point of the season narrative. I haven't felt this energised by a mid-season gear change since Dukat pulled the rug from under the Federation in the "In Purgartory's Shadow"/"By Inferno's Light" two-parter on Deep Space Nine's season five. You can't say that about Hugh's death. If you remove his death scene, season 1 plays out the exact same. If you remove Icheb's death, same, except you have to come up with a different excuse to get Seven into a two-rifle phaser blast scene.
One last thing. Picard as the Intrepid burned in space behind him. That is all.
I can't quite figure out what Jack's deal is, but
that weird webbing he keeps seeing reminds me of the Crystalline Entity for some reason (anyone else?), which of course has ties to Lore, who aren't we supposed to be seeing this season?
I've seen some negative feelings on
Ro returning only be to killed off but I agree, it was earned and meant something, both in concluding her long dangling fate and moving the seasons plot along in a very powerful way. Forbes was never going to return to be a recurring character in Trek, as sad as that is, so writing her out for good wasn't such a bad idea.
They were just lucky to get her back for such a brilliant episode and give her such a moving sendoff given this was really going to be her final bit of facetime in the franchise.
They were just lucky to get her back for such a brilliant episode and give her such a moving sendoff given this was really going to be her final bit of facetime in the franchise.
Just up to episode 4 and trying to avoid spoilers, but this season is very, very good. Very well written and acted.
My fiancée and our housemate have been watching films that are so bad they are good and tonight it’s my turn to choose. I’m going to be subjecting them to the horrors of Star Trek V: The Final Frontier in all its overacted, random romance plots, crappy special effects and fan dancing glory!