Discussion in 'Charts, rates etc' started by Animalia, Apr 10, 2017.
I want to assume you mean other than the remaining songs, but I've seen your scores...
Ditto! The fact that it made it further than almost all of Princess and the frog is triggering me right now.
You're no longer allowed around my river bend.
Yeah. The mangling of history is one thing (after all, romantic versions of the Pocahontas and John Smith story started popping up very quickly after it happened, though I wish Disney had at least tried to acknowledge that was what they were doing), but then there's all the Magical Native American shit.
Positive discrimination is one of my pet peeves in all of cinema, really, and Disney is... very blatantly patronizing about it here. It's obnoxious because presenting an entire people as glorious saintly guardians of the natural world deprives them of their humanity, especially when the whole history of the English and Powhatan is far more complex than the story-men of Disney could dream of, and it also leads to beat-you-round-the-head moralizing, a second pet peeve of mine. I know people like to pick on Dances with Wolves for Magical Native American shit, and not undeservedly either, but at least it tried for a bit more shading in characterizing the Lakota than Disney ever did with the Powhatan. (Yes, I am aware of what portrayals of Native Americans in cinema were like before, but going all the other way won't solve that either.)
I'm catching up and NOOOOOOOOO THE GOLDIE HAWN GAG I HATE YOU @send photo
Again: Oh no.
I half expected this to go out soon, but I'm still sad.
Marina's Savages was bound to be mentioned because it's that kind of impactful pop song and is so all-encompassing just like the album it came from. Before you come from me, it was on my mind too but as you can see I had other things to say in my commentary.
Great explanation! Never noticed that there was an original version of the song.
I was a bit bored by Pocahontas even as a kid, and I hope the remaining songs don't beat out too many of my faves. That said, I kind of stan John Smith as far as Disney guys go!
Savages actually really bothers me because they put in verses about the Native Americans calling Europeans savages as if to say they are equivalent to the Europeans committing genocide. Hard pass.
I don't take it like that at all. It's mainly just a 'who is the monster and who is the man'-lyric like in the Hunchback, with both parties seeing the other one as evil. With one side being a lot more right about that.
For completely justified reasons, which is why the song doesn't work. Like of course you're going to see people being evil as evil.
Yeah, that's bothers me too, even if it's compelling from a sonic standpoint. Reminds me of a lot of the false equivalencies used in political discussions these days.
Yeah, file that under the place where the rest of Pocahontas goes. Good intentions... but we all know what road those pave.
I think I can see what they were trying to do - having one group lead by hate, with the other merely responding to it. The lyrics on either side seem to point to the Europeans using the word "savages" in a derogative, racial sense, while the Native Americans are seeing these people invade their land and persecute their people, and so they're calling them literal savages. But that's just too complex a meaning to get across in the song, so it comes off as a bit "there are two sides to every story!!!" which is... yeah. Then again that theory is let down by having the "They're different from us, which means they can't be trusted" line on the Native American's side, which just misses the point entirely. I think it's a case of good intentions let down by the execution.
Anyway I should probably finish off cutting someone's 11 be right back x
Hawaiian Rollercoaster Ride
Highest Score: 11 x1 (@Lost Boy), 10 x2 (@ephemeralartery, @constantino)
Lowest Score: 0 x1 (@Mina), 3 x3 (@HollyDunnSomething, @Sideout, @Weslicious)
My Score: 8.5
Oh wow, I’m so sorry @Lost Boy. This is monumentally undeserved. I mean, it’s basically a montage of adorable Stitch moments set to a light, feel-good wee anthem of fun and adventure. What’s not to love? This is one of the occasions on which I feel Disney nailed the balance between a respectful, inclusive tribute to the culture on display in the film, and still making it sound like a classic Disney pop song. Drafting in a real modern day Hawaiian chanter in Mark Keali’i Ho’omalu to write and perform the song alongside The Kamehameha Schools Children’s Chorus gives the song such a natural, authentic feel to it that complements the scene so perfectly. Having only this and “He Mele No Lilo” providing a fresh Hawaiian twist to the Elvis-centric soundtrack was a brave move, but I think it works really well and, if anything, only serves to make this song all the more unique and memorable amongst the pantheon of Disney classics. Plus it has a line that sounds a lot like “let’s get drunk and surf’s up” which is always good for a kii. I guess it’s disappointing performance comes down to an unfortunate combination of the film not being a typical musical and people not having seen the film. Oh, and a suspicious non-English bias oop.
Now, before we dip into the commentary, does anyone know the procedure for reporting a mod? Asking for a friend. Anyway, entirely coincidentally, let’s begin with 2014: “I detest Stitch.” Huh, that’s an… interesting opinion. I didn’t think I’d need my torch and pitchfork set today so if anyone has a spare that’d be grand, thanks. We might as well run Mina out of town while we’re here too, who explains her illogical zero by saying “I have a headache now.” Okay but you gave The Unbirthday Song – objectively the most migraine-inducing horror in the rate – an 8. So… hmm. Thankfully Raichu is here to bring us back to sanity: “Goddamn Stitch is so cute. This song is too.” constantino sees fault, but good taste prevails: “Despite the unfortunate mixing (WHY are the vocals mixed so low??), imma chuck it a 10 because, like The Emperor's New Groove, Lilo and Stitch has only one representative in this rate. I will also say that the Elvis-heavy soundtrack for this film is a masterstroke from Disney.” DJHazey apparently forgot all about the King of Rock ‘N’ Roll though: “Did this have any other songs? I wanted to give this movie more support because I actually remember watching and liking the TV show that came out after. This is very dull though.” Okay I don’t agree about the song BUT YAS THE TV SERIES WAS LIT.
iheartpoptarts calls it “Such a cute metaphor.”, while LKane sees it a bit of an oddity: “Good one, but feels like a song from a Ghibli Studios movie, instead of a Disney Classic.” Sprockrooster, meanwhile, has other things on his mind: “I want to go to Hawaii so badly.” Forum holiday, anyone? We can listen to this on repeat for whole trip! Raichu’s in: “Goddamn Stitch is so cute. This song is too.”, as is MollieSwift21: “I didn't like Lilo & Stitch that much but this is a jam. Especially the bits in Hawaiian.”, and alanmr may not be a fan of the song but his love for Stitch earns him a ticket! “Now, I said before how taking part on this rate would be difficult to me because I never had much emotional attachment to Disney movies, but getting to this part made me realize I wasn’t 100% right on that, because I remember now how much I loved Lilo & Stitch growing up. The song itself isn’t all that remarkable, but the movie is such a sweet tale of friendship and family, with many believable and hilarious characters, and suddenly I know I always loved a tiny bit of Disney after all, even if I didn’t realize it.” See, I told y’all that everyone has an emotional connection to Disney somewhere.
Lost Boy didn’t leave any commentary, but if he had, I’m sure it might’ve looked a lot like ephemeralartery’s: “I stan Lilo & Stitch. Love everything about this movie.”
Ohana means family.
Family means nobody gets left behind.
Yeah no, cute and all but
1. Lilo & Stitch screamed 'straight to video release'
2. this song screamed 'cute bit of score with some vocals thrown in'
Aww, this one's a bit unfair. It's a fun tune from a fun movie with a fun soundtrack. It's got my favourite Elvis song on it, too! ("Suspicious Minds", for the record.)
I will say, that's one thing Disney always does well in its films with a non-European setting: blending that culture's music with their normal score sound in a way that's subtle but always very cool to hear. Mulan is probably the best place to hear that in action, but Lilo and Stitch does it very well too.
let me drop my commentary now.
FUCK ALL OF YOU I'M OUT.
The film is heartbreaking. It's hilarious. It's heartwrenching and hopeful. It's everything. EVERYTHING a Disney movie should be, whilst notfeeling like a Disney movie at all.
I literally teared up just watching a clip to make sure I had the Ohana quote right, so I feel ya. I can only apologise for everyone else's terrible taste.
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