The Marvel Cinematic Universe (MCU)

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Hopefully The Marvels performance hasn't put a Young Avengers project to bed
It'll definitely come, but they need to calm their boots and get some of those characters into successful movies/shows first. If they pushed on ahead now, it'd flop massively.

One huge test will be the Agatha show this year, and how well received Joe Locke's Wiccan is.
 
Watching Wandavision again and it really is the crowning jewel in the MCU.

Although Wanda was clearly a psychopath and maybe the character development in MoM wasn’t much of a stretch ddd

I kinda disagree though. Wandavision showed that Westview was formed from her grief and when in it, she had no clue how it happened. When she realised it was torturing people, she dropped the hex and sacrificed her family.

It was the Darkhold’s corruption that turned her in to the Wanda we got in Multiverse of Madness.
 
I kinda disagree though. Wandavision showed that Westview was formed from her grief and when in it, she had no clue how it happened. When she realised it was torturing people, she dropped the hex and sacrificed her family.

It was the Darkhold’s corruption that turned her in to the Wanda we got in Multiverse of Madness.

I don't feel like the Darkhold corrupting her was really an aspect of the plot that was really delivered properly. People who know the comics and theorize things heavily all were saying it, But I feel like MoM did a bad job of actually making it clear that Wanda was acting out of the corruption from the book rather than just rehashing everything from Wandavision for no reason.

I feel like they might've made that more clear had the people creating MoM gotten to see/know everything about Wandavision before creating MoM. But, it is what it is.
 
I don't feel like the Darkhold corrupting her was really an aspect of the plot that was really delivered properly. People who know the comics and theorize things heavily all were saying it, But I feel like MoM did a bad job of actually making it clear that Wanda was acting out of the corruption from the book rather than just rehashing everything from Wandavision for no reason.

I feel like they might've made that more clear had the people creating MoM gotten to see/know everything about Wandavision before creating MoM. But, it is what it is.

I do agree that it was total character annihilation in the movie.

If they were going down that route, then the corruption should have been shown more either at the end of the series or start of the movie.

It just seemed to be a complete 1-80, especially to the average viewer.
 
I do agree that it was total character annihilation in the movie.

If they were going down that route, then the corruption should have been shown more either at the end of the series or start of the movie.

It just seemed to be a complete 1-80, especially to the average viewer.

Agreed. Because from what I remember, Wandavision didn't establish that the darkhold had corrupted Agatha in any sort of way. She was already hellbent on some vengeance and the book just aided in that. So to me, it felt like Wanda in MoM was just acting out of her own desperation for her kids and using the power of the book to aid in that.

I think the next time we see Wanda, this will get cleared up though now that she's free from the book, she can give some clarity that it was driving her mad/evil and they can sort of rectify some of MoM's issues with the characterization.
 
He/Him
Hopefully The Marvels performance hasn't put a Young Avengers project to bed
I don't think it'll have any effect on that. Ms. Marvel is the only connection and doesn't seem like that would change anything.
Agreed. Because from what I remember, Wandavision didn't establish that the darkhold had corrupted Agatha in any sort of way. She was already hellbent on some vengeance and the book just aided in that. So to me, it felt like Wanda in MoM was just acting out of her own desperation for her kids and using the power of the book to aid in that.
It seems like Agatha was corrupted in a sense, not that it made her evil but the blackened fingers matched Wanda's in MoM. The Darkhold seems like it speaks to the readers desire and plays upon that aspect.

I think the next time we see Wanda, this will get cleared up though now that she's free from the book, she can give some clarity that it was driving her mad/evil and they can sort of rectify some of MoM's issues with the characterization.
I hope they show and not just tell as that's what has gotten us into this predicament. I understand why they wanted to keep it a surprise as to who was tormenting America but it really did a disservice to Wanda. Especially when that reveal did not hold much weight.
 
He/Him
I hope they show and not just tell as that's what has gotten us into this predicament. I understand why they wanted to keep it a surprise as to who was tormenting America but it really did a disservice to Wanda. Especially when that reveal did not hold much weight.
Even a couple of flashbacks after the reveal could’ve done the trick.
 
I was being a little facetious with my remark, by the way. Wanda’s reckless murdering in MoM and was one of the least nuanced takes on “going evil” that I’ve seen (although Lizzie still sold it and I enjoyed every moment she was on screen).

I’m just saying, in Wandavision, as much as we sympathised with our queen, it’s quite clear from mid-season (when she temporarily came out of the Hex) that she knew exactly what she was doing.
 
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All of this has already been said, but Wandavision was such a moment for the MCU. It was such a beautiful and nuanced take on greif, made even more amazing because it came from a series that would have mostly shied away from thematically heavy material.

It also benefited from the sitcom angle in that it had to inherently have a TV writing approach, something almost all of the other D+ shows were missing, making them a total slog to get through week to week.

MoM is made even worse because it literally smashed the WV character work to bits in order to allow that movie the chance to use the Scarlet Witch as the villain, when it wasn’t even close to the right time. Such a frustrating way to leave the character, especially since it’ll be ages before we see her again (if that even happens). In that sense it’s hard to make sense of what Wanda’s motivations were because they weren’t fully fleshed out, and were Frankensteined to fit the MoM narrative that was chosen. I hope they fix it down the line but I have my doubts.
 
Lots of spoilers from the Agatha show are leaking, such a shame.

I don't understand why they are holding this until October, Kathryn Hahn recently said she will be doing reshoots for it soon.
 
I don't understand why they are holding this until October, Kathryn Hahn recently said she will be doing reshoots for it soon.
They've already completed reshoots, they'd planned for a 5 day shoot and managed to get it all done in 1. Still feels a bit dumb that they are holding it until the fall, though I guess the Halloween timing makes sense.
 
Listen, I love and related to Wanda but even on a first viewing it was clear she was not innocent and definitely should’ve been charged with kidnapping a whole town. Wanda 100% knew what she was doing, she was just in her own little delusion and fooled herself into thinking everyone she trapped were happier this way. She legit did not care because she was getting what she wanted.

That and the fact they did state the Darkhold corrupts the user and then we see her using it and hearing her children made MOM make the most sense.

In saying that, where MOM fails is actually the fact you absolutely need to see WandaVision (without rose tinted glasses either) to understand where she is coming from. Sure she came to accept the loss of Vision and her children when she realized the former was never coming back and the latter two never existed but when faced with the realization the latter two DO exist out there, she relapsed. Sorry to say but, it happens. Healing is not a straight line and some people do unfortunately fall back due to a trigger (you could argue they never truly healed either).

You’ll never get me to hate MOM either because her killing all those characters was THE best moment of any Marvel film since the MCU began and judging y the reaction to it, we will never see anything as glorious as it again.
 
They've already completed reshoots, they'd planned for a 5 day shoot and managed to get it all done in 1. Still feels a bit dumb that they are holding it until the fall, though I guess the Halloween timing makes sense.

It makes sense why they pushed Agatha back. As the article mentioned it gives Marvel time to reshuffle things creatively and have the audience miss the MCU a bit.
I think Agatha will be worth the wait.
 
Echo was like an extended intro to something (and not even a standalone one at that - while they do explain everything from Hawkeye, not actually seeing those events play out make the entire thing seem nonsensical) and then it just ended. I both liked and hated the fact that they showed legacy as a supernatural aspect (it was both touching and too slight, and felt like they didn't have faith in the character without it, a very odd combination). And we saw a lot of waiting around for Kingpin, or Kingpin waiting around for Echo, which is in general how Kingpin has been shown to operate/what his vibe is, but I'd rather they had addressed what Kingpin and Echo hoped to get out of these situations/what they felt/what their reasoning was more directly and built around that more. All in all, it felt like a pilot episode extended to a mini series. The lead actress was fantastic imo.
 
This talk of Wandavision brings back so many memories - it was Summer (?) in the height of Covid, I would get up so early before working in my bedroom to watch and then come straight here to see the discussion and theories. It was such appointment TV...

..then on the other hand I don't really remember much of the Darkhold stuff or how it had repercussions for MoM and I don't think it's my memory. I know what was going on probably because of explanations I read on here. I blame MoM for that cus Wandavision is untouchable.
 
All the rumours of who Henry C**ill might be in the MCU fill me with dread. Especially
Cyclops. The first time he’s been interesting in years within the comics and they hire that sleezeball to play him in the movies?
 
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