TOTAL: From Joy Division to New Order (& More) Singles Rate ["True Winner": True Faith - 10.45]

Mr Blonde

Mr Blonde

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Welcome to my first rate! What we will be doing here is rating the singles of (Joy Division,) New Order (and all the off-shoots started by the four core/founding members of New Order). Whether you are an avid fan or just delving into their discography, I hope you hop on and enjoy the ride.

JOY DIVISION

This band sure made one hell of an impact for only releasing four singles (two released after the 'end' of the band) and two albums. Composed of Ian Curtis, Bernard Sumner, Peter Hook, and Steven Morris. Ian, who was epileptic and suffered from depression and other personal issues, was the frontman of the band and wrote all the lyrics. His lyrics were mainly melancholic and pained, which reflected in the band's sparse and gloomy punk arrangements. Joy Division would come to a premature end after Ian committed suicide. They never released singles from their albums (a trend New Order would continue for short while), so unfortunately due to the nature of this rate we don't really get to delve into the real meat of the band.

Transmission
Komakino
Love Will Tear Us Apart
Atmosphere

NEW ORDER

After Ian's suicide, the band continued as a three-piece and eventually recruited keyboardist Gillian Gilbert. Beginning as an almost facsimile of Joy Division, the four-piece would eventually evolve out of the eerie post-punk primordial soup and establish a distinct identity of their own. New Order began adopting more new wave and electronic styles over the course of four albums (Movement, Power Corruption & Lies, Low-Life, Brotherhood), trying to balance guitar-driven rock with synth-heavy dance, culminating in their (in my opinion) opus, Technique. Cue drama (inside and outside the band), a break up, a make-up, another break up, and a bit of a line-up change (the band is currently Bernard, Steven, Gillian, and two other guys). There were a few albums (Republic, Get Ready, Waiting For The Sirens' Call) released somewhere in there, too. And a new one (Music Complete) coming this September!

Ceremony
Procession
Everything's Gone Green
Temptation
Blue Monday (1988, -95)
Confusion
Thieves Like Us
Murder
The Perfect Kiss
Sub-culture
Shellshock
State Of The Nation
Bizarre Love Triangle
True Faith (-94)
Touched By The Hand Of God
Blue Monday 1988
Fine Time
Round & Round
Run 2
World In Motion...
Regret
Ruined In A Day
World (The Price Of Love)
Spooky (Minimix)
True Faith-94
1963 (Arthur Baker Remix)
Blue Monday-95
Video 5 8 6
Crystal
60 Miles An Hour
Someone Like You
Here To Stay
Krafty
Jetstream
Waiting For The Sirens' Call
Guilt Is A Useless Emotion
Restless

MORE

ELECTRONIC

Electronic was made up of Bernard and the Smiths guitarist Johnny Marr, with some early collaborations with the Pet Shop Boys. They've released three albums in total (Electronic, Raise The Pressure, Twisted Tenderness) with the help of some friends, including Karl Bartos from Kraftwerk. The sound of the band varies between guitar-driven and full throttle synth/dance pop.

Getting Away With It
Feel Every Beat
Get The Message
Tighten Up
Disappointed
Forbidden City
For You
Second Nature
Until The End Of Time
Prodigal Son
Vivid
Make It Happen
Late At Night

REVENGE

Formed by Peter Hook and a bunch of people who I don't care to list in the early 90s during New Order's first break, they only released one album (One True Passion) and then re-released it with a bunch of new material later on. Sounds very much like New Order, or a place where New Order could have gone.

7 Reasons
Pineapple Face
Slave
State Of Shock

THE OTHER TWO

While Bernard and Peter were off making music with other bands in the 90s, Gillian and Steven decided to make their own band (hence the name). They've released two albums, The Other Two & You and Super Highways. Very pop-oriented.

Tasty Fish
Selfish
Innocence
Super Highways
You Can Fly

MONACO

Another short-lived band started by Peter, formed from the ashes of Revenge with another former Revenge member David Potts. The band released an album in 1997 (Music For Pleasure) and another in 2000 (Monaco) that was initially shelved by the band's original label. Pop/rock with a dose of dance elements akin to Republic era New Order.

What Do You Want From Me?
Shattered
Sweet Lips
Shine
I've Got A Feeling
See Saw

FREEBASS

Born from three bassists: our Peter Hook, The Smiths' Andy Rourke (who then left before completing the album), and Primal Screams' Gary Mounfield. Topped off with vocalist Gary Briggs. Freebass have one album (It's A Beautiful Life), one single, and a few EPs and then imploded. It's a mid-2000s rock band with 2-3 bassists, basically.

Live Tomorrow You Go Down

BAD LIEUTENANT

Another one of Bernard's bands, this time with Phil Cunningham (now bassist for New Order) and Jake Evans. They've only released one album Never Cry Another Tear and two singles. The band's sound is much more straight forward contemporary rock compared to the other bands in this rate.

Sink Or Swim
Twist Of Fate

TOTAL: if I counted right, that's only 68 songs to rate! Shouldn't be too hard. Send me your scores via PM. 0-10, half scores are acceptable, and one song gets an 11. Commentary is more than welcome. The deadline will be September 6th for the time being (I'll shorten/lengthen the voting period based on demand if need be).
 
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Mr Blonde

Mr Blonde

In regards to songs with multiple mixes (like Bizarre Love Triangle's 7" mix vs 12" mix), go with whichever you prefer if you think it changes your score. I've only linked one version for the songs with different mixes like that, but feel free to seek out the others if you think they're different enough to warrant a change of score. Mention it in your comments!

This also means that I've consolidated all three Blue Monday releases (and both True Faith releases) into one entry. If enough people think that they would rather rate Blue Monday three times because the mixes are different enough to warrant different scores and rankings, I can make that change. I'd really like some feedback on this before I get the ball rolling.

However, in the case of Run, 1963, and Spooky, please rate only the mix that was issued as a single (the linked version). Even if you think the album version of Run or the b-side version of 1963 is better, I need your score for the single mixes only, please.

Final note, don't worry about Video 5 8 6. It's a great song, but the single release is around 20min and I don't want you fussing with that.

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LEADERBOARD
#68. Prodigal Son - Electronic (3.50)
#67. Live Tomorrow You Go Down - Freebass (3.86) [Freebass eliminated]
#66. Make It Happen - Electronic (4.59)
#65. Shattered - Monaco (4.91)
#64. Sink Or Swim - Bad Lieutenant (5.23)
#63. Late At Night - Electronic (5.55)
#62. 7 Reasons - Revenge (5.55)
#61. See Saw - Monaco (5.59)
#60. Twist Of Fate - Bad Lieutenant (5.64) [Bad Lieutenant eliminated]
#59. Murder - New Order (5.68)
#58. I've Got A Feeling - Monaco (5.82)
#57. Innocence - The Other Two (6.02)
#56. You Can Fly - The Other Two (6.02)
#55. Slave - Revenge (6.14)
#54. Vivid - Electronic (6.18)
#53. Komakino - Joy Division (6.32)
#52. Until The End Of Time - Electronic (6.32)
#51. State Of Shock - Revenge (6.36)
#50. Krafty - New Order (6.45)
#49. For You - Electronic (6.50)
#48. Waiting For The Sirens' Call - New Order (6.50)
#47. Restless - New Order (6.55)
#46. Pineapple Face - Revenge (6.55) [Revenge eliminated]
#45. Jetstream - New Order (6.55)
#44. Someone Like You - New Order (6.59)
#43. Shine - Monaco (6.64)
#42. World In Motion... - New Order (6.91)
#41. 60 Miles An Hour - New Order (6.95)
#40. Guilt Is A Useless Emotion - New Order (7.00)
#39. Sweet Lips - Monaco (7.05)
#38. Procession - New Order (7.09)
#37. Second Nature - Electronic (7.36)
#36. Super Highways - The Other Two (7.50)
#35. State Of The Nation - New Order (7.55)
#34. Sub-culture - New Order (7.59)
#33. Spooky - New Order (7.68)
#32. Run 2 - New Order (7.68)
#31. Tasty Fish - The Other Two (7.73)
#30. Fine Time - New Order (7.77)
#29. Everything's Gone Green - New Order (7.86)
#28. Forbidden City - Electronic (7.91)
#27. Feel Every Beat - Electronic (7.91)
#26. Selfish - The Other Two (8.00) [The Other Two eliminated]
#25. 1963 - New Order (8.05)
#24. Confusion - New Order (8.14)
#23. Shellshock - New Order (8.27)
#22. Ceremony - New Order (8.27)
#21. What Do You Want From Me? - Monaco (8.41) [Monaco eliminated]
#20. Here To Stay - New Order (8.45)
#19. Ruined In A Day - New Order (8.50)
#18. Transmission - Joy Division (8.55)
#17. Atmosphere - Joy Division (8.59)
#16. The Perfect Kiss - New Order (8.64)
#15. Tighten Up - Electronic (8.68)
#14. Temptation - New Order (8.77)
#13. World - New Order (8.86)
#12. Touched By The Hand Of God - New Order (8.95)
#11. Get The Message - Electronic (8.95)
#10. Crystal - New Order (9.00)
#9. Thieves Like Us - New Order (9.05)
#8. Disappointed - Electronic (9.23)
#7. Bizarre Love Triangle - New Order (9.32)
#6. Round & Round - New Order (9.36)
#5. Blue Monday - New Order (9.50)
#4. Regret - New Order (9.73)
#3. Love Will Tear Us Apart - Joy Division (9.86) [Joy Division eliminated]
#2. Getting Away With It - Electronic (9.95) [Electronic eliminated]
#1. True Faith - New Order (10.45)
 
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nnnumb

nnnumb

This should be an interesting one. I've been getting a little obsessed with JD and NO over the last few months so will certainly participate.

You haven't included anything from the An Ideal For Living E.P.though.
 
Aester

Aester

She/Her
I'm totally okay with the consolidation of the Blue Monday and True Faith releases, but if others feel differently, it wouldn't kill me to rate them all.

I seriously have no idea what my 11 might be. So many classics here!
 
Mr Blonde

Mr Blonde

nnnumb said:
This should be an interesting one. I've been getting a little obsessed with JD and NO over the last few months so will certainly participate.

You haven't included anything from the An Ideal For Living E.P.though.
Click to expand...

Thank you!

I just went with what discogs, rateyourmusic, and Wikipedia told me were single releases.
 
nnnumb

nnnumb

Their discography is a little convoluted I know. It'll be a good opportunity for me to re-familiarise myself with some of the offshoots though. I can't for the life of me remember the last time I heard anything by Revenge and I'm not sure I've even ever opened my Bad Lieutenant CD.

Should, hopefully, be a good turnout for this one.
 
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Eric Generic

Eric Generic

Wow, another fantastic rate to follow Fleetwood Mac.....I think I know my JD and NO singles even more than the Human League. New Order are easily my most-played artist of all-time.

As for the (re)mixes and stuff, True Faith and True Faith 94 are barely any different (after all these years I still can't tell them apart), but Blue Monday/'88/'95 are all slightly different beasts. I don't mind what the majority decide on those, but I'll include my scores for each just in case!
 
Mr Blonde

Mr Blonde

Eric Generic said:
Wow, another fantastic rate to follow Fleetwood Mac.....I think I know my JD and NO singles even more than the Human League. New Order are easily my most-played artist of all-time.

As for the (re)mixes and stuff, True Faith and True Faith 94 are barely any different (after all these years I still can't tell them apart), but Blue Monday/'88/'95 are all slightly different beasts. I don't mind what the majority decide on those, but I'll include my scores for each just in case!
Click to expand...

Initially I was going to go with having all 3 as separate entries, but I didn't know how many people would bother giving them separate ratings. And yes as I was trying to find a link to True Faith 94 and realized I can't tell the difference, if there even is one!

I've included links to listen to all 3 versions, so hopefully I get a little more feedback on that after people listen to them. I was thinking of potentially having people submit 3 scores, but only the original version (or only the version with the highest score) would be ranked.
 
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Ray

Ray

Why is "Murder" included and "Video 5-8-6" not, out of curiosity? (I kinda love "Video 5-8-6") People could skip it if it's too long...

Also can I give a 10.5 (or five of them)? Please...?
 
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Mr Blonde

Mr Blonde

Thanks @Ray I'll fix that once I'm back home.

I've decided to not include Video 5 8 6 simply because it's 20 min long. I thought it might be asking too much. I could include it if people want it in.

And sorry no 10.5's! Haha.
 
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Ray

Ray

There is so much goodness. I did the New Order and Electronic part yesterday and I have so many 10s. Not many acts that were so consistently genius for years. I've been forcing myself to give "only" 9 points to some songs.

Luckily Bad Lieutenant and Monaco are coming to lower my average score a bit.
 
Ray

Ray

Speaking of Monaco, was "Shattered" a single? I only know it as b-side to "Sweet Lips", Wikipedia doesn't even list it as promo release...
 
TrendyMüller

TrendyMüller

Question: The Temptation version you linked is not the original 12" mix if I´m not mistaken. Was this remixed for Substance? The drums and the whole atmosphere is much beefier and more "mid-80s" here. The original was more fragile sounding.
I think this is the correct 12" version:
To complicate things further: the 7" version is a completely different recording and no edit/remix
 
Mr Blonde

Mr Blonde

Yes, Temptation and Confusion were completely re-recorded for Substance. I didn't know where to draw the line when it comes to alternate mixes. How much of the difference is too much of a difference? So I just went with every song getting one entry, and voters can submit their scores for whichever they feel is the definitive mix (key here will be commentary!). Not a perfect system but I didn't want a situation where the top 5 consists of 3 mixes of A + 2 mixes of B.

Ray said:
Speaking of Monaco, was "Shattered" a single? I only know it as b-side to "Sweet Lips", Wikipedia doesn't even list it as promo release...
Click to expand...

According to Discogs, it had a limited 12" release (there's even a proper sleeve for it). Very much skirting the limits of being a single.
 
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Hairycub1969

Hairycub1969

I'm certainly up for this rate!
And I'm glad Electronic are being included - their debut album from 1991 is still in my all time favourite top ten albums

I agree about the remix situation - in far as one vote for one song and then in the commentary mention which version you are scoring for - s/b interesting for Blue Monday/Temptation/Confusion - in all cases I prefer the original 12 inch version.

I refuse to acknowledge that "True Faith" was ever remixed in 1994 - as you guys have mentioned already - I can't tell the difference! By the way I actually liked George Michael's cover of "True Faith"!
 
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